[S1914] Legacy-Removal Feedback Thread

freezy

But improvements will definitely be happening, it's not just an empty phrase. You can take a look at Call of War, we actually removed the old view mode there (called Canvas) as well over a month ago. The initial reaction to that was similar to here, but we collected a lot of feedback and made changes and now the feedback got much better already. How things turned out in CoW was a good proof of concept. I hope that we can achieve the same here.

I can also tell you that turning off the old view modes in CoW and S1914 has so far barely been noticable in the games' KPIs (metrics), so you don't need to worry that the games are going down due to these changes. Far from it, we are making them ready for the future! And you and your feedback will certainly play a part in this, so a big thanks to everyone for their help and loyalty over all these years.

Keep the feedback coming!

Hi,

You can't compare CoW to supremacy in terms of what the players care about and how they will behave, I think. The CoW players pretty much only know the current version and like it, which is why they play it. Long faithful legacy players must like something else now. That is a big difference! Surely there will be many new players again with time. But how loyal they are, is uncertain. And whether they bring quality also. In any case, I hope that the combat options in the new version will be the same as in legacy version.

E.g.: 1. button for patrol when i move my planes to a certain province. This is not always the shortest way.

2. own edited army only with mouse pointer over enemy army go without editing, there must be the runtime displayed until the own army is in range.

This is the most important for me. Besides graphical clear overview. I will see in due course if it works then.

Thank you.

freezy

I have to say that the Coke analogy doesn't apply here. The Coca Cola company probably immediately saw in their market data how worse the adoption rates and revenues of the new coke were, and they had to react to them. The situation is exactly the opposite to S1914. S1914's main metrics all improved since we launched the revamp mode and made it the default 2 years ago. Before we launched the revamp mode there were even talks in the company to let S1914 slowly fade out because it was performing worse and worse and didn't meet today's standards anymore. But we decided to give it one more big shot and thus the Revamp was born. The metrics improved after we launched it. If we hadn't done that the game would have died already. Would you have prefered that? I know not everyone is a fan of the new graphics but perhaps it is better than no game at all, right? I can tell you that nowadays with the Revamp S1914 has the best metrics since its inception a decade ago. Most amount of active players, highest revenues. So it was all worth it. And this is not only coming from new users who leave the game after some days, I really have to disagree with the notion that this is our new playerbase. We still have alot of die-hard players and that is backed by metrics, the average account age is actually quite old for our user base. Plus, as I told earlier in this thread, since we deactivated the legacy mode last week we barely see any change in S1914's metrics.

So yeah, while Coca Cola saw in their data that they made the wrong move and had to react, we are not seeing this in our data - to the contrary. We are making the game ready for the future and our data supports that. We have to constantly improve to stay relevant in today's gaming market. As I said earlier, we also try to incorporate your feedback where we can and you can indeed expect some improvements in the next weeks. I hope you hang in there and continue to provide us with feedback.

oh, then congratulation for your move into the furture.

The "metric" etc seems quite optimal.

So, no need to do anything for the old legacy player, at all.

Certainly, they will join revamp as soon as they understand

the intentions for the relaunch.

Spare your working time for the user who like the new UI

and want to become a die-hard player in this environement.

Go on and enjoy your success.

Just, wow wutant. Freezy, a game designer who can effect changes, takes the effort to give feedback in here, is here to try and help, who is opening the floor to improvements, and you try to slam the door shut?

Just, wow South Paw.

Yes, as a Customer, I dared to respond to a posting from a game designer.

I don't know, how much influence a game designer has to open something

in this company.

But in general I don't care, because I believe in the right of free speech -

no matter, which position a person has who I respond to.

And furthermore your interpretation of my posting

is not my interpretation of the posting.

Slyx

I like the AoE II analogy and completely agree with you on that a decrease in usability is not preferable. However somewhere else a comparison with windows 7 and 8 was made, which I found to be far more fitting. Win7 was a gem. It was functional fairly soon after launch, it as intuitive once you got used to some key functions and a large portion of systems ran it so it was well supported.

Then game windows 8. Lets simply not talk about windows 8. It was terrible and doomed to fail for desktop users right at the start. Creating an "all in one" solution has downsides for everyone and upsides for only a few.
Fortunately this is not what we're trying to do. We have a dedicated desktop and mobile viewmode so we don't have to pack everything into one mode. I'd like to compare legacy and "new" to windows 7 and 10. Let me emphasize that I was determined to use win7 for as long as possible as I knew everything I needed to know for my daily work and private interests. Win10 didn't appeal to me, it was new, I didn't want to relearn processes that I had already mastered and it promised little to no advantage at that point.

I was pretty much "pissed" when I was forced to switch due to discontinued support for win7 and work. I quite literally made an effort to downtalk win10 and to boycott it, but eventually had to give in. Everything looked weird, I was upset because some functions were different and I simply didn't know as much as I did in win7. I still knew how an operating system works however. I knew how do utulize a task manager, how to set up my hdds and not to delete sys32. Pretty much all it took for me to accept win10 was to get used to some redesigns and to accept that it isn't exactly like win7 in every way. By now, I don't even recall what win7 supposedly did better. Win 10 outgrew its baby issues as it saw continuous support, many others switched to it so I was able to learn from and with them and now I'm at a stage where I will probably defend win10 until the bitter end.

Long story short: we're not trying to force you to play a desktop strategy game with a mobile oriented view mode. We're already evaluating your feedback on how to improve the "new" standard and will continue to improve it over time. In the end every one of us at Bytro invests 8-9 hours a day working on something that is related to our games so you can be damn sure we're not just doing whatever without thinking about it first. In some cases we're limited by time, in some by ressources but in none by willingness to improve. To be honest, we're all just human so in rare cases we simply might not see the best solution right away or have to correct ourselves. This doesn't mean we will roll back to legacy and throw every hour of work that went into the now standard mode over board but instead we'll try our best to learn and incorporate feedback in order to do the best possible job we can.

Textwall over, Slyx out
(not really but it sounds cool)

Very interesting ideas. I do agree, i had similar experience whith w7 to 10. Its a great comparrison but is the new mode truly w10 , or actualy w8? I would say as it is, whith no changes, the new mode is w8. Not user friendly, unecessary, a step backwards from legacy. I say this beause just like i did whith w8, im actualy giving a shot to the new mode, but i still havent found the "oh this isnt that bad actualy" moment. What i keep finding is frustration, and a bigger and bigger desire to return to "w7". Maybe whith further updates and good feedback, the new mode might become "W10". But atm. I dont see it. And the irony of this new mode is the more i play the current round whith it and the game naturaly gets bigger and whith more units, all the disavantages become more and more apperant. The reasons for this ive already said in other posts, and a lot of people have made good feedbacks about it. So whoever designs the Ui has some decent material to work whith.

I do hope the devs can turn this arround.

main issue with removing Legacy is that it was replaced by Revamp which is not working

can we do something about that revamp issues which destroy gameplay experience?

I really tried to play in the new mode for a whole week. It is impossible and not playable for me. I have barricaded my running games into the archive. But since my army line runs until September, I have asked Bytro for a refund.

This is the answer: Thank you Bytro!

depeche 101

I really tried to play in the new mode for a whole week. It is impossible and not playable for me. I have barricaded my running games into the archive. But since my army line runs until September, I have asked Bytro for a refund.

This is the answer: Thank you Bytro!

I can not read German or copy paste for Google Translation from a screen shot, did you get a Refund?

I am sure AKAIR gave you very nice 'scripted' response

Seriously, you should consider the avatar issue.

It's almost invisible: not even in diplomacy you can see your own leader's face

Hastings TNT

I can not read German or copy paste for Google Translation from a screen shot, did you get a Refund?

I am sure AKAIR gave you very nice 'scripted' response

no I have not received back

https://gyazo.com/6918f1adc862e0c23433c4eaf2389d49

Please, I think this can be improved, it really costs a lot to locate each element ... thanks and greetings

I have been playing supremacy since 2014. I used to love this game. Now, however, it is downright terrible. It is confusing, difficult to navigate, difficult to operate, and impossible to enjoy. The maps are clustered and polluted with unnecessary animations that make other important things hard to see clearly. The side tabs for diplomacy, stocks, etc. are small, and the functions themselves are unnecessarily complex. The icons and labelling of units are impossible to easily view and asses, borders and travelling lanes are difficult to see. The coloring of other countries on the map are far too similar and nearly impossible to distinguish. Just two minutes ago I had to click on provinces to determine where Japan ended and China began. Totally unplayable, totally ruined. It is an incoherent mess that you should be ashamed of. You forced new players into the new mode, blocked them from legacy mode, and then gave your most dedicated players the shaft and destroyed the game. I will likely never play again. Call of War is almost as bad.

My resignation
(for some reason my old forum accounts didn't work and I was not able to log in, so had to make a new one)

I have been playing supremacy 1914 for just over 7 years, I started with this game when I was a kid and I have had 3 different accounts up throughout my time on this game(I was never good at saving passwords, I've never played a game with more than 1 account). I have loved this game and long supported it both financially and by sharing the game with others, I have gotten over a 100 people to play this game and around 20 who have played it for multiple years. My newest account (which is from early 2018 still has over 100,000 goldmarks I will never get to use(not that I want to use it but a point to show how investet I have been in the game). I do struggle with dyslexia and as many others have pointed out I struggle with the new version which lacks optimasation for both color blind people and just makes everything look a lot more confusing (a lot better graphic wise of course but it is not for me). I have long supported the newer version of the game, which was in development for many years, but I personally did not like it when it came out. All I want is for Legacy to be an OPTION for the many of us who support it. Obviously the new version should be the focus. And I believe it worked great both for us and the developers when legacy mode was an option. By the looks of it, it seems legacy is gone for ever, and with this I hand in my resignation to the game. I loved Supremacy1914 and it gave me a lot of enjoyment throughout the years, hell I have even found and made some great friends on it. People I once met in a game, where we backstabed and fought against each other, but ended up adding each other on whattsapp and later discord, now we still hold contact and some I have even visited in the real world. I will miss supremacy but they do say all good things must come to an end, and for me the good things about S1914 was Legacy mode.

Best of luck to everyone sticking with it!

llora la vaca

https://gyazo.com/6918f1adc862e0c23433c4eaf2389d49

Please, I think this can be improved, it really costs a lot to locate each element ... thanks and greetings

Perfect image on my problems with the newer mode, and that's just 1 relatively small attack...

Https://gyazo.com/a31269da18614c1f49630fbf834472b5

Another example, if he did not know where those 19 soldiers are, he could not know without first having to move them. We know that this is not possible in certain circumstances of the game because it would involve a war.

This is getting ridiculous. Seriously, why can't we have this?

Is it really so hard to implement it in revamp as an option? Not to mention tactical armies view WAS A THING before.

1sec look at this stack gives me a 100% info about its composition and location.

This thing would solve like half - if not more - of the complaints...

for all those who are leaving because of revamp - thank you very much that you made that game and community fun place to stay

you will not be forgotten!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gLVqjIvokc

ps. consider starting own topic where you write what you have achieved in the past decade in supremacy, that is history which should not be forgotten

Extra info i just noticed. I cant even diferentiate information from what i see from unit view range, from information from spies. They use to have a different look. Now they dont. Another thing to improve

revamp path finding broken to the core

in legacy when AI/Human took ROW from you all paths were recalculated to avoid causing war, from what I remember. Since revamp came I caused ,only in one map, 15 unintentional wars. troops were not stopping after ROW was removed and marching into neutral provinces. Rally points were pushing new units straight through everything, not even checking if we still have ROW.

looks to me that revamp path finding works only once- when you give order to move or create rally point.after that 0 checks are done if the route is still valid. whoever removed those check should bring them back. remove graphic from revamp, not mechanic that is needed for game to continue normally. noone cares about nice models but when game causes you 15 wars because it's systems are broken

ofc everything started when someone decided to change popularity system without proper in-depth testing how this will influence gameplay, but this is another story

all to all revamp is so broken and probably unfixable ( if almost nothing was done to fix it for 2 years) GMs and HC are here to save your time but revamp forces you to quadruple check if everything works as it was intended to because of multiple issues. so you finish fixing yourself all bad commands revamp has done. Revamp does not meet any criteria of p2W software unfortunately and should be shut down immediately till it is in playable state , not some alpha stage. it is not playing anymore - it is fighting UI and fixing all mistake UI and server have made.

that is ofc my private opinion as a game designer and pro-player: waste of time to use revamp as you are forced to spend several times more time than playing same map in legacy

you can have your own opinion but it starts to remind me Cyberpunk when they released it

Golden Buddha

revamp path finding broken to the core

in legacy when AI/Human took ROW from you all paths were recalculated to avoid causing war, from what I remember. Since revamp came I caused ,only in one map, 15 unintentional wars. troops were not stopping after ROW was removed and marching into enemy provinces. Rally points were pushing new units straight through everything not even checking if we still have ROW.

looks to me that revamp pathfinding works only once- when you give order to move or create rally point.after that 0 checks are done if the route is still valid. whoever removed those check should bring them back. remove graphic from revamp, not mechanic that is needed for game to continue normally. noone cares about nice models but when game causes you 15 wars because it's systems are broken

ofc everything started when someone decided to change popularity system without proper in-depth testing how this will influence gameplay, but this is another story

all to all revamp is so broken and probably unfixable ( if almost nothing was done to fix it for 2 years) GMs and HC are here to save your time but revamp forces you to quadruple check if everything works as it was intended to because of multiple issues. so you finish fixing yourself all bad commands revamp has done. Revamp does not meet any criteria of p2W software unfortunately and should be shut down immediately till it is in playable state , not some alpha stage. it is not playing anymore - it is fighting UI and fixing all mistake UI and server have made.

that is ofc my private opinion as a game designer and pro-player: waste of time to use revamp as you are forced to spend several times more time than playing same map in legacy

you can have your own opinion but it starts to remind me Cyberpunk when they released it

This is so true. I also caused already 2 unitentional wars whith AI because of the pathfinding, something that never happened to me before. I also saw some other players having the same issue.