Use Commandos

I feel as if the 1.0 commandos and the 1.5 commandos are completely different units. The 1.0 commandos are more like assault troopers (20.0 damage against inf in mountains) while the 1.5 commandos are more like elite saboteurs.

It is a bit like (to use context) the Royal marine commandos vs the SAS. The Royal Marines were about being elite troops that punched hard while the SAS are more about sabotage and taking out targets.

whowh wrote:

I feel as if the 1.0 commandos and the 1.5 commandos are completely different units. The 1.0 commandos are more like assault troopers (20.0 damage against inf in mountains) while the 1.5 commandos are more like elite saboteurs.

It is a bit like (to use context) the Royal marine commandos vs the SAS. The Royal Marines were about being elite troops that punched hard while the SAS are more about sabotage and taking out targets.

Habo778 wrote:

In 1.0 I used commandos as a mid-late game unit to replace my infantry in my offensive stacks

Commandos are very good and should be researched early

For me, I use armies of 10 Commandos to wreak havoc behind enemy lines, destroying any isolated units and hampering enemy unit production, works wonders tbh. Also good for use in general in mountains and forests against everything.

Habo778 wrote:

Also the main defensive scouting unit is the armored car and commandos are strong against light armor which makes them perfect

BMfox wrote:

Habo778 wrote:

Also the main defensive scouting unit is the armored car and commandos are strong against light armor which makes them perfect

Few players use armoured cars as they are a weak early game unit that gets wrecked by light tanks. The ultimate scout unit for me is the motorized infantry as they are super fast and have great stats. If there's one unit that can give a commando a good fight it's motorized infantry. Also interceptors can reveal stealth units.

BMfox wrote:

Habo778 wrote:

Also the main defensive scouting unit is the armored car and commandos are strong against light armor which makes them perfect

Few players use armoured cars as they are a weak early game unit that gets wrecked by light tanks. The ultimate scout unit for me is the motorized infantry as they are super fast and have great stats. If there's one unit that can give a commando a good fight it's motorized infantry. Also interceptors can reveal stealth units.

Fully agree, cars are critical for rapid early expansion.

I don't produce a lot of mot inf until food and goods production are well developed, as those same resources are needed for recruitment stations.

The primary drawbacks of commandos are slower speed and need of AA protection.

BMfox wrote:

Habo778 wrote:

Also the main defensive scouting unit is the armored car and commandos are strong against light armor which makes them perfect

Few players use armoured cars as they are a weak early game unit that gets wrecked by light tanks. The ultimate scout unit for me is the motorized infantry as they are super fast and have great stats. If there's one unit that can give a commando a good fight it's motorized infantry. Also interceptors can reveal stealth units.

-available earlier

-better defense against aerial units at comparable lvl

-more HP/health in the end

-different building and resources (no food)

-defensive, you dont always have the choice in fighting, when you are attacked is up to the enemy. So, AC's are better in that respect. A stack of AC's has very respecable attack power when pouring into unprotected areas behind enemy lines, but without support, defense against enemy units, especially aerial units, survivability (defense + health) is vital.

In any case, Commando's are really nich, so they suck as they are expensive and require research resources are limited so pick the (10/least) best units you need, not 11 or more.

Gen. Smit wrote:

BMfox wrote:

Habo778 wrote:

Also the main defensive scouting unit is the armored car and commandos are strong against light armor which makes them perfect

Few players use armoured cars as they are a weak early game unit that gets wrecked by light tanks. The ultimate scout unit for me is the motorized infantry as they are super fast and have great stats. If there's one unit that can give a commando a good fight it's motorized infantry. Also interceptors can reveal stealth units.

There are good reasons to opt for armored cars over motorized infantry,

-available earlier

-better defense against aerial units at comparable lvl

-more HP/health in the end

-different building and resources (no food)

-defensive, you dont always have the choice in fighting, when you are attacked is up to the enemy. So, AC's are better in that respect. A stack of AC's has very respecable attack power when pouring into unprotected areas behind enemy lines, but without support, defense against enemy units, especially aerial units, survivability (defense + health) is vital.

In any case, Commando's are really nich, so they suck as they are expensive and require research resources are limited so pick the (10/least) best units you need, not 11 or more.

Militia; the poor man's Commando.

[WARNING: Contains Hyperbole)

Thanks for pointing out that Commandos are also 'stealth' in Plains terrain, but Militia still beat them...

I didn't used to even research, Militia, until I realized that they are not your typical, stackable fighting unit. They are more like the Spy unit in the old Tesla Wars game...

Now, I research them, as soon as I cap a city with a barracks.

Advantages:

Cheaper, expendable, faster to produce, available earlier, faster movement then the unwieldy stacks players insist on marching in. (You stack to fight; not to march.)

Elite Militia allow one to win the game, before Commandos are even available to research... A level one Commando is going to be spotted by a destroyer 30 miles off shore, while your Elite lvl3 Militia is having a croissant, in a Parisian Cafe, un-noticed

Like, Troop Transports; always upgrade, Militia or AT guns as soon as it is available. Best bang for your buck in this Economy intensive game...

The fact that they must stick to the Forest and such, makes their movement paths fun, and exciting for your opponent. (Once, Sweden, who had declared war on ME, wrote in his 'quit message', to 'go terrorize someone else'. It was probably the Militia...)

Gambit #69: Get RoW with everyone you can; never Shared. Fill every one of their Dots with Militia.... It's just insurance: Some Allies turn to the dark side Terrorize them in your sleep.)

(And, no; Cars are not fighting units, but you do need one per stack... When you split the stack to march. force march the Car to the next dot, and your entire stack avoids the 'moving on enemy territory' degradation. Your entire frontline moves twice as fast: You win the game in 2 weeks, instead of 4.)

"Only AI wannabes stack an AA gun with an infantry unit and expect to get anywhere this year" - Ronald McDonald

Gen. Smit wrote:

There are good reasons to opt for armored cars over motorized infantry,

-available earlier

-better defense against aerial units at comparable lvl

-more HP/health in the end

-different building and resources (no food)

-defensive, you dont always have the choice in fighting, when you are attacked is up to the enemy. So, AC's are better in that respect. A stack of AC's has very respecable attack power when pouring into unprotected areas behind enemy lines, but without support, defense against enemy units, especially aerial units, survivability (defense + health) is vital.

In any case, Commando's are really nich, so they suck as they are expensive and require research resources are limited so pick the (10/least) best units you need, not 11 or more.

Lord Crayfish wrote:

Why not both?

Because having both dilutes your research, and there is rarely need to build different units with similar functions. MI's and AC's are both fast scouting units. Sure, they can also fight, but both are somewhat fragile, and both should be primarily used in a scouting role after the first few days. At the start, Everything is Awesome.

Similar example, you could build regular and motorized artillery, but if you're going the motorized route then it's silly to keep upgrading regular artillery. Focus on maximizing the one that's best for you, depending on doctrine and resource production. Comintern with lots of food? Regular arty. Allies with lots of oil? Motorized arty.

z00mz00m wrote:

Lord Crayfish wrote:

Why not both?

Because having both dilutes your research, and there is rarely need to build different units with similar functions. MI's and AC's are both fast scouting units. Sure, they can also fight, but both are somewhat fragile, and both should be primarily used in a scouting role after the first few days. At the start, Everything is Awesome.

Similar example, you could build regular and motorized artillery, but if you're going the motorized route then it's silly to keep upgrading regular artillery. Focus on maximizing the one that's best for you, depending on doctrine and resource production. Comintern with lots of food? Regular arty. Allies with lots of oil? Motorized arty.

Interesting that this isn't mentioned above on the ways armored cars are better. You only need to research armored cars. There are no preliminary research necessary. With Motorized Infantry, you also need to research Infantry. Plus since you already start with two, if you keep them relatively healthy, you can research advanced levels and upgrade the starting ones.

Mot. Inf have 5 levels to research too while ACs only need 4 to be max. Max ACs also have 10 more hp compared to max mot. Infs.

Tacs also are more popular than atks so you'd be better off building cars just in general, add into that their better AA values, every little bit helps.

Back to Commandos. Why do they claim land? In Conflict of Nations they have very nice role of hunting aircrafts on airports but it's impossible to do in CoW because they claim land so they will be spotted hours before they can reach any airport.

So whats the purpose of Commandos if they can't work behind enemy lines? Are they front line unit?

look for targets of opportunity have an escape route keep out of sight

Sewur wrote:

Back to Commandos. Why do they claim land? In Conflict of Nations they have very nice role of hunting aircraft on airports but it's impossible to do in CoW because they claim land so they will be spotted hours before they can reach any airport.

So whats the purpose of Commandos if they can't work behind enemy lines? Are they front line unit?

1) Commandos claim land because that is what all land units in CoW do. As always, the function of any unit in this game, which is representative like all games, should be harmonious with all others by obeying similar rules along the same game mechanics.

2) Call of War is not Conflict of Nations. It is separate and distinct. It is like Supremacy 1914 or Iron Order 1919. Just because something exists in CoN does not mean this game needs it.

3) I do not think of commandoes as front line units. When there is a defined "front line" at all, my frontlines tend to use regular infantry, mech infantry, artillery, and usually medium tanks. Once these have broken through the line, motorised infantry and armoured cars, maybe augmented by light tanks, should exploit the breakthrough by capturing the lightly defended rear. Of course air support ought to be offered throughout.

Where commandoes shine is in raids behind enemy lines, in order not so much to capture land as to destroy buildings, seize loot, and divert enemy forces. especially to before a true breakthrough can be made. They can do this via sea landings or moving into defenceless provinces, particularly in forests. Many or most players put airfields just behind the front lines and in doing so place them in harm's way.

4) Keep in mind that this is a battalion, and such large forces seldom if ever took part in any raid undetected.

If you want forces that can quickly move behind to enemy lines, there are also paratroopers. This is in fact one of their main purposes. They are not so good against aircraft convoys though. I usually use tactical and attack bombers on those.

Lord Crayfish wrote:

Where commandoes shine is in raids behind enemy lines, in order not so much to capture land as to destroy buildings, seize loot, and divert enemy forces. especially to before a true breakthrough can be made. They can do this via sea landings or moving into defenceless provinces, particularly in forests. Many or most players put airfields just behind the front lines and in doing so place them in harm's way.

Ok, lets say they are somehow behind enemy lines. They are slow, easy to find, no air defense. Armored car does the role way better.

I will answer my own question then. They are breakthrough force because they cant do anything else. Which is weird.

In CoN Commandos have something special. In CoW their use is basicly:

-Hope that enemy artillery will run without stealth reveal and the artillery will run on your Commandos and there are no enemy aircrafts nerby or your Commandos are gone.

-Capture 1 province unnoticed and watch enemy aircrafts coming for your expensive Commandos.

Lately i defended use of Heavy Tanks but i dont see how you can do anything useful with Commandos other than use them for their raw stats in favorable terrain.