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Midway literally ruined Japan’s chances of winning the war completely. Without those carriers they couldn’t properly fight the war. It was over at that point.

Carking the 6th wrote:

Midway literally ruined Japan’s chances of winning the war completely. Without those carriers they couldn’t properly fight the war. It was over at that point.

France.

But we could argue the Germans lost at Danzig as well…

Claudio NVKP wrote:

France.

Are we allowed to start some controversy in this thread?

hmmm, let's see this one

What race am I? Pole? Jew? Russian?

TheZhukov wrote:

What race am I? Pole? Jew? Russian?

Let's not be too brutal and say you're Polish.

Germans left Pro-Nazi non-Jew poles alone sometimes, so......

Carking the 6th wrote:

Midway literally ruined Japan’s chances of winning the war completely. Without those carriers they couldn’t properly fight the war. It was over at that point.

Carking the 6th wrote:

But we could argue the Germans lost at Danzig as well…

Claudio NVKP wrote:

The same exact thing could be said about Japan. If they succeeded in Midway? Held the US back enough to collapse China? They could have at least made it too expensive to kill them and survived. Losing their carriers meant they stood no chance in the modern era of carrier battles. By Stalingrad, the German’s fate was sealed with them at war with both the US and USSR. By the fall of France, Stalin was planning to kill the Nazis once their war with the west was finished up (he kinda knew about their whole genocide thing ). The Reich’s days were numbered..

Then why did Barbarossa come as such a shock to him? He honestly believed he had friendly relations. The old story that the communists wanted to take over the world is mostly a myth, cultivated for use in the Western world.

I am not perpetrating the pre-emptive attack myth. It was because he believed that Hitler wouldn’t be dumb enough to start another two front war, since that would be suicide. He was right and wrong. Stalin and the USSR had been watching German rants about the Judeo-Bolshevik scum for a while now. They were ideological rivals and quite directly despised each other. They simply signed Molotov Ribbentrop to split Eastern Europe, exchange technology, and gain resources for Hitler and buy time to recover from the purges by Stalin.

Still, Stalin saw the rhetoric of the Nazis. He also liked the idea of his enemies in the west and Germany taking each other out while he builds up. It was his hope that the UK and Germany would continue to bleed each other dry, allowing the Union to strike once prepared at their massively weakened militaries.

But more importantly is Nazi rhetoric, to be honest. Their whole plan was Lebansraum (spelled wrong.) to rid the world of the Commies and Jews and give their “Aryan race” land to expand. Hitler saw this as their destiny. They never were not gonna attack the USSR. And if the USSR attacked first, it would basically be the Pre-Emptive strike that Suvorov so likes to peddle.

BTW the commies did have a bit of wish to take over the world, or at least to secure their western borders and Moscow by subjugating Eastern Europe. I’m no fan of Cold War propaganda BS but the Communist Bloc (separately Russia and China) was definitely wishing to gain some form of dominance. So was the West.

There are few what-if's here

1. Didn't Hitler offer a peace deal to the UK many times, which was rejected by Winston? What if he accepted.

2. What if Hitler accepted Russia into peace when Stalin offered.

Claudio NVKP wrote:

There are few what-if's here

1. Didn't Hitler offer a peace deal to the UK many times, which was rejected by Winston? What if he accepted.

2. What if Hitler accepted Russia into peace when Stalin offered.

Issue here, you’re completely changing the Nazis. Their goal was complete eradication of Jews, Communists and most Eastern Europeans, they literally never would have accepted that, unless they stop being Nazis. And that’s just fantasy.

Claudio NVKP wrote:

hmmm, let's see this one

NEPTUNE the great wrote:

Carking the 6th wrote:

Midway literally ruined Japan’s chances of winning the war completely. Without those carriers they couldn’t properly fight the war. It was over at that point.

Agreed, but Stalingrad was deadlier, the Germans had to face close-to-close combat in destroyed buildings. They also had to worry about snipers.

Which one?