Call of War 1.5 round 2!

Game 3,039,393 call of war 1.5 round 2.

Not sure if this small bug has been pointed out already but I'll post anyway.

I have a large mixed stack, 31units (BR17).

Selecting this troop while stationary shows 5 possible orders in the info window. Select the troop whilst moving brings 9 possible orders which of course doesn't fit in the info window. The stop option is off the bottom of screen.

Move, attack, upgrade, split, add target, delay, forced march, fire control and a ninth, stop.

Can not upgrade my level one tanks.

Need a timer with numbers for plane refueling. The circle is nice, but how long?

cycle9 wrote:

By day 10 the man power shortage is alleviated somewhat. Mostly due to not

researching much. Most unit types still level 1 or 2, and no real benefit to

raising that level.

Got laminated by two powerful coalitions in one game.

game day	active players	place	VP	units
10	8	2	190	136
7	8	2	110	82
lost
9	11	1	180	105

A few more players quit, and not the level 11-20 players, some were 40+

I imagine they saw the adds for Sone and quit CoW to go there?

About upgrade, I have a suggestion. Dont need to change update cost but once upgrade completed, refill unit morale to 100%. Maybe a good idea?

Razz123 wrote:

Need a timer with numbers for plane refueling. The circle is nice, but how long?

try using chrome or dragon.

I dont know if this was issue before, but I would like to report battle ship issue in 1.5, when you cant click at convoy or submarine when its really close to battleship. like this ... I mean, maybe would be enough to change model direction of unit with every page refresh a bit.

or here... my submarine is in fight and I cant even check its HP ... link

Kudia,

I have had the same problem with your issue in the current version as well.

I have solved this issue by closing my browser, clearing out the cache through "Internet Options" in the Control Panel. Then rebooting my computer. It has worked for me and I know it has worked for at least one other.

The only other times I have had the problem is when your units, (Air Craft and Naval Units that are stationary), up in the Bearing Straight Area. There is nothing you can do for that. What you have to do for that is to either....

1) Click Cnt F and type in your unit number so you can get control of it and then move it.

If you don't know the unit number

2) Click on a different unit and the use your arrow key to scroll through all your different units until you get to that unit and then move it.

I hope this helps solve your issue.

General cdub

I am coming to the belief that the 30 minute build time for the basic production units is OK for your core provinces but should be substantially higher when in non core.

Also people are leaving their low level troops around a lot because of the manpower issue and it is easier to build a facility close to the front and pump out low level troops every 2 hours.

Makes more emphasis on having High Command to Queue up troop production.

Major problem as mentioned above, Start game after work. Play two to three hours.

Wake up and a few players have captured two countries.

By giving players more units and easier to build at start, creates a massive rush.

To make the game faster you have destroyed it.

You have done nothing for the AI !!!!!

AI needs to be stronger its a massive push over.

Not only that, please for the love of god, bring back the old unit production times and allow for unit production in ALL providence's. It'll give the players who DON'T have high command the ability to build units that take the same amount of time as everyone else without having to log on every few hours. That's really sneaky and unfortunate that you've implement this feature into the game. Not only that but it just causes more problems. Players who DON'T have high command are at a significant disadvantage due to not being able to que 5 different units. And as mentioned above, the rushes are not good. Why change something that wasn't broke in the first place?

EZ Dolittle wrote:

I am coming to the belief that the 30 minute build time for the basic production units is OK for your core provinces but should be substantially higher when in non core.

Also people are leaving their low level troops around a lot because of the manpower issue and it is easier to build a facility close to the front and pump out low level troops every 2 hours.

Makes more emphasis on having High Command to Queue up troop production.

page 6 comments:

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Airfields and Air factories make no sense.

An Airplane factory which comes with an airport is built in 30 minutes.

An airfield without a factory, takes 2 hours.

What we need is to have them separated so that you can build an airfield faster than a factory and that then you can build an airfield in a city without a factory.

Michael Myres wrote:

btw i think militia should be available in any province that would make sense

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Manpower- two games into day 5 and 8 (playing the same country so that I could compare different starts).

One of the major problems is that you can not buy manpower on the market and you cannot trade it. Therefore it becomes a major bottleneck and it is thus also a major attraction for Gold use.

Strongly disagree with the use of it in research and construction especially when you consider that the manpower pool is in the game totally available for military units, which is not the same when it comes to research and construction. In fact most of the research manpower may actually not be 'man'-power at all. Additionally we know that in WW2 the employment of women as in Rosie the Riverter was a major factor in the running of factories. Therefore to keep with the theme of WW2 manpower should not be applied to construction and research.

Maybe the manpower has to be adjusted downward over time to show the depletion of the conscript pool.

Violet_Trooper wrote:

Perhaps some upgraded units would have less manpower required, or upkeep per say, to show technological improvement and effective and cheaper equipment?

Ex.

lv.1 Infantry 50 food upkeep

lv.2 infantry 100 food upkeep

lv.3 infantry 150 food upkeep

lv.4 infantry 120 food upkeep

I dunno, it was the first idea that came to mind so it ain't a great one.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Airfields,

There is no indication in the description that a level 2 or 3 airfield decreases the refueling time.

This is a missing critical piece of information.

FinnDaddy wrote:

Very interesting and I find COW 1.5v2 much more complicated and strategic than original COW. I like the vast majority of what has been done. You should consider a skill based ranking system to go along with the experience based one that counts unit actions and construction, and beef up the stats in general. Here are a couple things that I think need work:

1. The market is ineffective due to the cost to buy and sell. Why do you have to pay the commission when you post a sell order? When I am out of cash and want to sell something, I can only afford to put up a few hundred units for sale and that sale might not go through. The offers to buy any resource are now 1.2- 1.3 per unit for each resource except the one I am out of, lol, but the lowest direct purchase price is much higher. A market with a huge bid ask spread is not a properly functioning market, but do to the scarcity of cash and risk of prepaying for a trade that may not even go through, I cant place trades to narrow that spread. There seems to be decent AI participation, but half have embargoed me already. Take away the upfront trade cost and only impose it on the seller, not the buyer.

2. Aircraft time/speed to react to threats- With the speed up in ground unit speeds, the 30 min attack timer, the new way unit damage delays killing units, the insane refueling times, I feel you have destroyed the ability of a few bunkered units time to hold out defense for air support to even make a difference. even 6 bunkered lev 2 infantry could not hold out verses 20 mixed lev 1 units for 30 mins (hit at zero mins and 30 mins, down 15 percent health at first hit). This is a big change from COW 1 where my aircraft would not take 2+ hours to return from a patrol one airport away and move to soften the attackers before they hit, then get several patrol or direct strikes before the stack hit again). Aircraft and light defenses were a great and necessary way to not require a gigantic economy crippling build up of defensive forces, and it also allowed us to quickly help allies. I guess this is just a whole new strategy to get used to.

3. Just a last comment about naval strength. I just build a lev 2 destroyer and it has a military strength of 10 vs my battleship lev 1 that has a strength of 7.5. This seems strange to me. Perhaps change the strength metric to include all the attack and defense attributes, plus health and range. It would be a big change from now and a huge number, but I think it would be more reflective.

Thanks

2. I advise to also build some lvl 2 airstrips and rather use airstrips over aircraft factories, to easily lower your refueling times. Combat is probably also faster because the combat calculation is now accurate and you are dealing the damage that is stated in the unit details, as opposed to CoW1.0, where you obscurely dealt only a fraction of that damage. We will likely lower the stack limit from 15 to 10, this already will prolong battles indirectly a bit again, so that your fortress troops may hold out longer against a big army. Also keep in mind that a lvl1 fortress in CoW1.5 does not provice the same high benefit as in CoW1.0. They have the same max values for the highest levels, but a more even progression towards that. Costs have been reduced for early levels to make up for that.

3. The strength value in the interface only shows the strongest damage value, which is 10 against submarines for the destroyer lvl2. The display has always been like that, for example with Anti Air having displayed higher strength values than Infantry. Frankly the strength value should not be used to compare different units, as the battleship lvl1 in your case would still win vs. the Destroyer lvl2, as the battleship has higher anti naval damage and higher HP.

General cdub wrote:

• Starting out, there is not enough Cash and resources starting out. It’s about 1/3^rd of what we get in the current version.

We will tweak the availability of resources again in the next Event to deal with that.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

So maybe not a bug but a feature that you have always reset your travel after you take a province along your route. This is not a good feature by the way.

So your display was just giving you the old information, and when you reloaded you got the newest information which is the way it is supposed to work.

Page 7 comments:

General cdub wrote:

My Humble Assessment on the new 1.5 Version (Page 2)

• All countries start out with the same amount of Resource Production, (Double of each of the 5 main resources).
• It is far too expensive to upgrade your units and you have to upgrade each individual unit. I still do not understand why you are insisting on not giving us automatic upgrades as we complete research when every post I have read from other players have stated we do not like this concept. However, if you persist with this, then here are some options.
  • First, there should be no cost associated with upgrading your units in the field. We have already paid for the unit build. The penalty we pay is the down time while they are upgrading. It makes it near impossible to upgrade your existing units. It also takes away Build Que from HC members as you have to clear everything out just to save up the resources in order to do this.

    [list]

  • As a side note, I believe if you are going to insist on this being put into 1.5 despite the feedback and you make us pay for the upgrade, then I believe that most could live with say paying only in Manpower or Cash or maybe both.
  • Why would anyone want to upgrade a unit that is now going to cost them double, triple or more to get to the highest unit level? The odds are their health is lower than 100% so it would make more sense just to build new units and leave your lower level units out there to die.

    [list]

  • It is almost like you want us to lose our units. If you upgrade nothing in the field, you would also have more units vs the same amount after upgrade.

[*]Give us an option to upgrade all units at the same time without having to go to each individual unit. That is if we can afford it of course.

[*]The upgrade button is in the Orders Box. This can put too many buttons in the box and hides the stop button. It would be nice to just click on the unit in the unit box and upgrade a specific unit, (ie: such as you would do when wanting to disable a Naval Base or Barracks)

[/list][*]Can only build units in cities.

• You get 5 cities, capture your enemies 5 cities and game is over for them.
• There is no strategy in this. All you have to do is gather up as many units as you can and rush the cities. Forget about the other provinces, you can go back for them later. Taking out those cities, you know your opponent can’t build anymore units. This only gets

[/list]

Upgrade costs will be lowered probably in the next Event to make upgrading more worthwhile. For this Event I advice skipping 1 or more levels with the upgrading, then the cost is still worth it, as you only pay the resources for the target level, not for the levels in between. Since units increase in ~30% power per level and this stacks up, upgrading becomes worthwhile again at a certain point. Plus you save the costs for upgrading the production building immediately and save half the time needed for production and the travel time to the frontlines (time is money, as the saying goes). Due to all these advantages having no costs would be OP (e.g. players spamming alot of lvl1 units and then upgrading all of them to save alot of costs & time), so we wont budge on having it cost, but as I said we will likely lower these costs.

You can already upgrade all units at the same time by selecting multiple armies (e.g. hold right click (desktop) or finger (mobile) and then draw a circle, or use double click)

Army bar size will be increased in the next Event to accomodate for the additional buttons.

I would say there are still alot of strategies in the concept of cities. The strategies just have changed and the focus has shifted. Yes you now have important cities and taking them out cripples your opponent, but your opponent will also defend these sites more fiercely. A new dynamic develops around this concept, where players have to think about plans of attack to take out these targets. On a sidenote, players losing their cities in CoW1.0 were pretty much doomed as well in most cases, not much changing in that regard.

General cdub wrote:

My Humble Assessment on the new 1.5 Version (Page 3)

worse as the game progresses as it costs more to build units as research goes up making it near impossible for a player

• All the point Provinces are the Cities.
• Cost & Time to build units go up with the higher research.
  • Time to build units also increases

    [list]

  • How can you justify that it takes almost a day to build a Level 3 Anit-Air Unit?
• Take a Level 3 Artillery, at 1570 in goods, it is almost out of range to build.

• Adding in Rare to build units also puts the units at higher level impossible to build

[*]Unit Health and Damage seems to be all in chaos

• Lost 5 Lvl 1 Bombers & 5 Lvl 2 Bombers against an opponent’s 12 stack unit without destroying one of their units. I will add that there was not any AA in the stack.
  • Their overall health did decline but they never lost any units at all.
• 1 Level 1 Tank lost 38% health after attacking and destroying a convoy of 2 Flying Bombs

• Units mysteriously lose health here and there when taking unoccupied provinces.
  • I had two different Infantry units drop from 89% to 73 percent moments after taking an unoccupied province
  • I had one Light Tank drop 5% after taking an unoccupied province
• Even though it shows only a .7 defense to Air compared to Infantry at 1.5, Tanks were doing more damage to the Air Squadrons than Infantry was.

[*]Artillery units have no benefit to upgrades other than strength.

• You have preset all Artillery Units to a range of 50 even at the Elite Units.
• The way this is set up with the increase of cost and time to build, you might be better off just staying with level 1 and building a bunch of them or going to SP Artillery strictly. You could probably get more damage having 10 Level 1 Artillery than say 7 level 2 or above. Plus they would be cheaper to build.

[*]Big problem with moral.

• With 50 provinces and a moral of 82, I captured 1 province and my moral dropped to 77. This of course dropped my resource production on all resources.

[/list]

Costs and times have to go up with power increase for a proper progression system and to incentivize upgrading unit & resource production capabilities. In the late game you can afford the units just as much as in the early game because your production has scaled as well, there is nothing out of touch. If you find certain units impossible to build (like the ones costing rares that you mentioned) you are maybe focusing too much on building units which cost the same resources. I for example have no trouble producing higher unit levels costing rares in my game.

Cannot assess that battle without more info what units where in the enemy stack and which level they were, plus the terrain. Planes are in my view pretty balanced right now and I am still using them quite effectively.

Convoy stats we can still lower, right now they are balanced with the higher damage progression in mind, so higher level units will fare much better against convoys than lvl1 units. Also, convoys are not totally helpless, they still have troops escorting/guarding them.

There is no way units can lose health without any cause. There must have been one that you missed, as I never experienced that and also did not read about any other players reports on that. If you catch it again please submit a bug report, because that would be no CoW1.5 specific bug.

Likely your tanks did overall more damage to the air squadron because tanks have more HP and a different armor class, so your aircracts took longer time to destroy the tanks and received more damage in return. Plus it can also be about the terrain, with tanks receiving a +50% buff in plains. You always have to look at all the different stats than only 1 damage value. We could of course still lower AA values of tanks further.

On the artillery range I already commented in this thread. This won't change to not break the progression system, as 1px more range could theoretically mean unlimited amount of power increase if you outrange an enemy without taking damage.

There is no reason why your morale in all provines should drop in morale because you conquer one more province. The mechanics on morale increase/decrease did not change in 1.5, only some thresholds for capital distance. I actually got reports that morale penalties are now not harsh enough anymore as the "at war" penalty got removed. Maybe different tastes here.

General cdub wrote:

My Humble Assessment on the new 1.5 Version (Page 4)

• Infrastructure is basically obsolete giving no real value.
• Rare now associated with build costs on certain units and buildings
  • It is hard enough to get rare as it is and this will only slow down the production of certain units.
  • All Air Bases and Air Strips require Rare.
• Refueling time takes too long
  • One of my Air Bases takes 45 Minutes to refuel, a level 2 that takes 40 minutes and yet another one that takes an hour.
  • It took my Air Squadron almost 3 hours just to fly three provinces over and over 8 ½ hours to fly from the Beirut to Moscow.
  • This makes Air very vulnerable as well

    [list]

  • Let me tell you what most people are going to do.

    [list]

  • They are going to build a bunch of Flying Bombs and I mean a lot of them. Then they are just going to fire them at all the Air Strips and Air Bases. The health is so low, (even with a level 2), it will take them all out. Then your Air will be in a convoy and they will just keep firing at them until they destroy them. While some can argue that this can be done in the current version, I beg to differ if you know what you are doing with your air and how to protect them. With the refueling times of what they are now, there is no way to protect them. I have always said that I believe Flying Bombs and Rockets need to be double the cost and take twice the time to build.
  • Honestly, 30 to 60 minutes? Someone on your development team actually thought this was a great idea and the players would like this?
  • Yes, it takes only two hours to build an air base, but why would you do it if you just lost your entire Air Force?
  • Even a level 3 Air Base I believe the refueling time would still be 20 minutes. I could never afford to build one when you have a cost of rare of 2850.

[/list][/list][*]Times vary for upgrades in the field. Some units were 1 hour 45 minutes. Artillery is showing 2 hours 15 minutes.

• I believe this is maybe a percentage of what it takes to build the current level of the unit
  • Just set it at one time for all units

[*]Fighters having a lower strength on defense.

Getting rare is not hard at all, not harder than any other resource as the value and production rate is now equal. It of course depends on which units you focus. Perhaps you also received a country that has less rare production than other countries, that could be a factor of course. In my game for example my rares were the most common resource in the early game, until I started producing more planes.

edit: just saw in a later comment that you play turkey, which has indeed no rural provinces producing rares, compared to other countries who have 1 or 2 rural provinces producing rares. That's the country differences I mentioned.

If people want to spend all those resources on flying bombs to take out airfields, I would say: Let them. The more valid strategies, the better. There are always ways to deal with stuff like this.

Refuel times are actually between 60 and 10min or between 30 and 10min, depending on building and level.

And yes airplanes definitely needed more refueling times as they were too mobile in 1.0 compared to all other units (they can already jump over alot of provinces and striked anywhere within a large range), plus there needs to be an incentive to level up airstrips, which now lowers refuel times significantly compared to 1.0. Even with the new refuel times planes are still much faster in getting from point A to point B on the map.

Upgrade time currently is 50% of the production time of the target level, we will likely keep this.

All planes have lower stats on defense than on attack to a) prevent the plane patrol defensive exploit and b) to encourage direct attacks more, which most often were sub-par to patroling.

General cdub wrote:

My Humble Assessment on the new 1.5 Version (Page 5)

• Strength and Speed of Tanks in Cities
• Global Popularity still drops when someone invades your provinces and you declare war on them before they take your province.
  • This still needs a major overhaul

    [list]

  • You should not be penalized due to the size of your military, (that is what this game is about after all)
  • I agree that it should drop if you do not Declare War, (Surprise Attack)
  • You should not be penalized if you declare war on someone that is attempting to invade you. As it stands now, if someone is moving in on your province and
  • You should not be penalized because of your relation to another nation that has a low GP. You may have made a NAP Agreement with that Nation and you don’t want friendly fire so you have ROW with them to prevent that.
  • Even with a High GP, it is very rare that you get the AI to ever change their status with you. This goes both for ROW or if you were at war with an active player that now has gone inactive and you want peace, you can’t get it.

[/list]

you declare war on them, you are penalized, not them. What are you supposed to do, let them attack you first or take your province first just so you can hold your GP?

In summary I can only say that I am very disappointed in the product you brought out. I spoke to a few of the players in our map and they all said pretty much the same thing that I thought. This was a very boring map/game as nobody could build anything as the research increased. There was a lot of down time as well. I have never had to stop building and advancing my troops. Three different times I had to do both that amounted to almost 33 hours of down time, (doing absolutely nothing at all). Most all had level 1 units in the field as they could not upgrade them and after research, most could not afford to build newer units due to cost after research so they stopped researching. Air is basically ineffective not only due to cost, but the damage they take compared to what they deal out. That and the refueling times make it a very slow game with a lot of down time. You have taken out a very important part of the game. In every war, Air was a very important part of it. In order for Air to be even remotely viable, you would need to build 25 to 30 Bombers and hopefully you did that after your research was at least a level 2. But then you probably would not be able to do that unless you did not build any ground units or even upgrade your buildings in your provinces. Having Rare associated with build costs on so many items

Strength of tanks in cities receives no buff, compares to buffs for most infantry and some ordnance units, which makes tanks vs. other ground targets in most cases worse when fighting in cities. Same effect achieved as in 1.0 by just using buffs.

Yes, popularity drops when declaring war, just like in 1.0. Fixing this would be very complex as there would need to be checks constantly going on if the other party has units going to attack cities of the other player. Probably not coming in the near future.

The availability of resources will be tweaked in the next event to reduce down times.

I disagree on the viability of Airforce, iny my experience they are now pretty balanced compared to their OP-like status in 1.0. They can still strike anywhere they want and take out easy targets and force the enemy to consolidate his troops or invest resources into air defense. So still very useful especially since they cost different resources than most other units, and if you don't want your rares go to waste you probably will produce airplanes as well. Which makes them perfect support units to go alongside ground offensives, just as they were in WW2. Wars cannot be won with an airforce alone, but you could actually do that in 1.0, and we did not like that.

General cdub wrote:

My Humble Assessment on the new 1.5 Version (Page 6)

including just a basic Air Strip hampers everything in the game. You have pretty much priced yourself right out of the market place.

I understand this is a business and you need people that are willing to pay to play. At the same time, you need to keep the ones you have even if they do not pay to play. If you lose them, you will lose a great deal of your customer base. If you lose that customer base, well then you have less people playing and less competition. It then becomes a tailspin. Once in that tailspin, it is very hard to recover.

Maybe if you shared with us players, (Your Customers), of what you are really trying to achieve here, more players could help you with what is good for us and not just you. Is it to get new players? Is it to keep the players you have here long into the future? Is it to get more paying customers?

In the end, if I were a new player and joined this game, I would not stay. I would get bored and move on to find a better game. I would hate for this to happen and not saying that it is going to. But I am not sure even I, after all these years of playing Call of War would stick around. So you know, once you lose your players, they are not coming back. They will find another game that they enjoy more and stay there. Even if you send them emails with great offers to come back, they won’t. Trust me when I say, I have had those same emails from previous games. I didn’t go back as I found Call of War.

I am sorry this is so long but it is the notes I kept over the first 7 days. I didn’t want to be posting things I was not sure about at the end of each day. As you see, I did divide them up into 6 posts so it was not 1 long post that nobody was going to read.I am sure there are still many things I left out, but I am in hopes that you will take this feedback seriously and give us a product that is as good as the current version if not better.

With all due respect,

General cdub

The thing is, taste can be very different. While you for example are disappointed with this second 1.5 Event, you can read in this very thread also opinions from players who are very delighted on the changes in 1.5. So it is not a black and white thing. Nedless to say we will try to improve 1.5 further and incorporate more feedback again in the next Event, plus adding more exciting features down the road. This is still not the end product and there is room for improvement.

This all said, I still thank you for testing and providing all the feedback, every kind of feedback is valuable to us. I just wanted to give you my perspective on most of the concerns mentioned

-0-0-0 wrote:

I feel that the new "upgrade" feature is far expensive to be used, in time and resources, as we can't cancel the upgrade once launched or heal our units. For example: Infantry level 1 in 38% Condition being upgraded at Infantry lvl 3 Research, will cost the same as a new infantry level 3 and will take 4 hrs 10 minutes. Will our units upgrade to lvl 2 or actual lvl 3? Will condition be restored as a new unit? I suggest that the new upgrade feature would be affordable if: cheaper, faster or profitable (Condition benefit).

At day 9 of my game (#3038039) I feel that the Rythm of the game has been enormously increased, level 1 units with level 1 building can be produced at little cost and time. For example: Destroyer Lvl 1 produced at Naval base lvl 1 will take 2 hrs 45 minutes and will cost -1k resources in exception of Money that is +1k ($1,160).

The pros I found are:

-The new Resource balancing for all countries, now I'm able to choose any country and leans towards any strategy in mind.

-Advanced units (Commandos, Railroad gun, Strategic Bomber,...) are easily reachable

-I feel the AI is getting better

-In combination with the new Buildings config, we are able to have lots of units of different types (Infantry - Ordnance - Tanks - Air - Naval - Secret) at early game, as basic lvl 1 production for most lvl 1 units is cheap and easy.

--Advanced units are available at early game:

*Strategic Bombers, that can be produced in 14 hrs hours since game started (9 hrs of production + 5 hours of research) with a cost of -2k in all resources.

*Battleships, than can be produced at day 2 with 21 hrs (day 2 + 16hrs research + 4:15 hrs production) with a cost of -2k resources

--Massive armies (In comparison of regular COW) can be spawned at early game:

*8 Anti Air at Lvl 1, can be produced at day 1 (22hrs production / 30 min research) with a cost of: -4k Food /-6k Goods /-8 Mnpwr (1.4k research / 5.8k production) /-2k Metal /-6k Money.

*7 Cruisers at lvl 1, can be produced at day 1 (22:45 hrs production / 2:30 hrs research) with a cost of: -4k Food /-10k Mnpwr (6.7k production + 2.5 research) /-6k Metal /4k Oil /10k Money.

The cons I found are:

-The new Research config might become counterproductive, the vast amount of time that is increased to the production cost when producing an advanced unit might be unaffordable for a lvl 1 Barrack, for example: We can upgrade Infantry to level 3 at day 4 and a lvl 1 Barrack will take 18 hrs to produce it. In contrast, lvl 1 Militas can be produced in 45 min at lvl 1 Barracks since day 1.

-The increased Game Rythm has leaned me towards MicroManagement, the fast/cheap building and unit costs is making the game more demanding for me, sleeping/studying/working seems deadlier in late game. X_X

Those are my impressions at day 9, am hoping to survive until end game and have a new experience to share with you later Am really looking for CoW 1.5 and not a new game, am sure you'll reach the correct balance.

Btw, I think the new Game Design looks fantastic, all the new unit skins looks bomb I love the Japanese one! (May Blitzkrieg game mode be possible with Japan included? )

The long production times of higher unit levels using a lvl1 building are intentional, as we want to incentive upgrading the production buildings. If you want to be most time-efficient, the building level should be the same as the unit level.

I think in late game the game should not be that much more time demanding than in early game, because times and costs scale so much compared to 1.0, where the gap in activity was much greater between early and late game.

Also thanks for the nice list of stuff you like.

cycle9 wrote:

Only day 9, so the unit upkeep costs is a mere 1/3d of the daily production.

Cannot imagine the draw down between day 21-30!

Maybe depends on how much you upgrade Industries and how much you conquer.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

The Zhuchov quote is not translated right into English ... it should be "as if"

If you are on the PC and you have High Command you can select an item for future production if there is nothing already producing so when the resources arrive it builds. On the mobile you cannot queue something up if there is nothing being produced in that category,

The Mobile queue issue is known, its on our list of mobile improvements to be made.

Tasmine wrote:

About Homeland defence bonus. I think devs dont understand what is the best. Espcially in 1.5, you can only produced units from urban. Once homeland province falled. Defence bonus 15% will turn to 0. Then where is the homeland defence bonus?

->player should have 15% defence bonus even province falled.

And I rememberd Freezy said he played a game with a good experience. Are those players are inactive? I fighted a very good player with double units while my units spread all the place, try to crashed my peace treaty. Well, I used 18000+ gold to build 2 forts, 1 lv2(30%+15%) and 1 lv3(45%+15%). Then keep add morale on my wounded infantries. Finally stop the attack wave and I got better K/D ratio.

Oh, and lost 6 hours sleep time too.

Due to my play hard. Our game not just 2 coalitions. There has 3 now. If I didnt play this game. Maybe 2. Because you got more power. It's easy to knock others down.

In the view of game speed, player think too fast. Because if you didnt have artillery to guard your units they will bombed to death in the short time.

The game also slow, develop unit tech require more time. And if you dont level up your milotary building. High level units produced very slow.

So, if a player said CoW is fast or slow. Both correct.

If devs want to update this game. Why not try to one thing right? Balance, history detail, stragy. Supremacy 1 is doing good on this point. I know this forum is for Call of War. But look at S1. Why cant borrow the experience?

In supremacy 1, player can use balleon, scout or spy to expose target position. S1 has gas artillery to damage units on area. Easier to get than CoW Nuclear weapons. There has road player need to defend it or enemy may sneak in. S1 doesnt has the unit history picture for each level update. But it's original art. In this part, I think it's better than CoW too.

A real CoW 1.5 should like this. Make something really different and interesting. I played S1914 and S1 almost the same time. Once I played S1. I dont want to touch S1914 again. Can CoW can become a game like that?

Not sure what you are trying to say with the middle part. That the pacing still has some issues? Yeah we can work on them and tweak times and resources.

We dont try one little thing at a time because that would take years until we are done We don't want to only change some stuff, but to change alot of stuff. S1 is also changing alot of stuff while it was in early access mode, and was a huge deviation from S1914 in the first place. And of course S1 is more advanced in certain aspects because its the newer game. It has newer art and newer features. But we are trying to catch up here in CoW, and hopefully when we are done you also want to play the newer version much more than the old version. Plus we want both games to have some distinct features which the other game does not have, so we won't copy everything.

Btw as a side note: Since you like S1 so much and they have a vastly higher game speed, I am not sure why you dislike some of the speed increases in the early game. Even with them CoW is still quite a bit slower than S1.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Speed Bug ???

Initially

I had a stack of infantry in Lille of Level 1 at 95% and level 4 at 92%

Speed details are level 1 is 30 and level 4 is 36 on the terrain of both Urban and flat.

Speed of the level 1 to Paris 3 hours 50 minutes

Speed of the Level 4 to Paris 1 hour 54 minutes

There seems to be either a missing factor here or there is a bug in the scale since the there is only a 20% difference in the displayed speeds but a almost 100% in actual 'race' times.

HOWEVER 10 minutes later after going to another game and back, the speeds had been adjusted down to a relative correct relations. Have no idea what causes this.

Razz123 wrote:

Upgrade cost too high, especially man power

Limiting production to cities could make the game faster. However I like building in any province.

The player that takes the most provinces at start win. Why, because you are only stuck building in three cities.

Too many wars at start and no consequences. I saw players conquer two countries in two days.

Need to be back war weariness. Make it 2 for first war. Add 3 for 2nd war and 5 for each war after that.

African counties are too powerful. Not realistic for a WW2 game. However, if you want all countries to be equal thats your design.

African countries still have an advantage. Should reduce the amount of resources they have. Why? Because they don't have any neighboring countries to fight.

Resources should be based upon how many counties are next to you.

You could slow down there production rates to fix this for counties in Africa and Mideast

Milita should cost zero or be reduced in cost.

Make Industry available on any province after level 3 infrastructure. Maybe let player build all factories and units too.

Can not upgrade my light tank level 1 to level 2

After buying Naval bomber, Statistics for attack and defense do not show up when you click on it.

Unit production in cities likely to stay. Reasons were explained earler in this thread.

If you overrun multiple cities the other players has a hard time coming back, yes, but that is not different to CoW1.0, because the high cost of IC lvl1 prohibits them being built in rural provinces in the early game.

War morale penalty was removed to not penalize players for doing what the game requests them to do. Instead the AI will declare war on them to deal with that with actual gameplay. And a player at war with multiple players is already at a disatvantage over a player who is not, as he has to fight multiple enemies. No need for an additional penalty here.

Equal strength of countries is per design in non-historical maps, no change here from CoW1.0.

Amount of neighbouring countries also depends on the map of course.

Militia we can still balance further of no one is building it.

You can upgrade your light tank from lvl1 to level 2 if you have researched level 2, have the resource for it and your unit not currently doing any other action like fighting or being on the water.

Don't know what you mean exactly with the Naval Bomber report. Cannot reproduce it. If it happens again, please submit a bug report and explain exactly what happened.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Speed of game

I am finding that the opening especially is more time sink intensive. That is that you have to be on line much more than in the prior version. This has good and bad features. It may reduce the drop out of new players because there is more action in the start, but it will also cause problems for those that actually work and sleep for 8 hours at a clip/

While being able to be on line every 2-3 hours around the clock in a focused game, this is not the typical profile.

Maybe we will have negative 'speed rounds' where the game takes 50% or 100% LONGER than the prior 1.0 version where the x2 x4 x10 versions are attractive.

DO OTHER PLAYERS find this TIME SINK to be the same case or is it just my feeling?

Negative speed rounds is a possibility we can explore once 1.5 is released.

Page 8 comments:

cycle9 wrote:

the only time that it hurt not to be online for 8 hours in a row was due to two coalitionsinvading at once, and taking the entire country before I awoke.

Normal build, recruit and maneuver functions require very little time. In fact, the limitations

in resources, cash and especially manpower, allow me the luxury of plenty of time AWAY from

CoW1.5, even with four (now 3) games going.

pjrobbo wrote:

Game 3,039,393 call of war 1.5 round 2.

Not sure if this small bug has been pointed out already but I'll post anyway.

I have a large mixed stack, 31units (BR17).

Selecting this troop while stationary shows 5 possible orders in the info window. Select the troop whilst moving brings 9 possible orders which of course doesn't fit in the info window. The stop option is off the bottom of screen.

Move, attack, upgrade, split, add target, delay, forced march, fire control and a ninth, stop.

Kudla wrote:

I dont know if this was issue before, but I would like to report battle ship issue in 1.5, when you cant click at convoy or submarine when its really close to battleship. like this ... I mean, maybe would be enough to change model direction of unit with every page refresh a bit.

or here... my submarine is in fight and I cant even check its HP ... link

EZ Dolittle wrote:

I am coming to the belief that the 30 minute build time for the basic production units is OK for your core provinces but should be substantially higher when in non core.

Also people are leaving their low level troops around a lot because of the manpower issue and it is easier to build a facility close to the front and pump out low level troops every 2 hours.

Makes more emphasis on having High Command to Queue up troop production.

Also, for future Events we plan to implement a feature that increases production times when province morale is low. That would already mean that freshly conquered provinces would have higher production times, I guess that alleviates the concern.

THEARBITER117 wrote:

Not only that, please for the love of god, bring back the old unit production times and allow for unit production in ALL providence's. It'll give the players who DON'T have high command the ability to build units that take the same amount of time as everyone else without having to log on every few hours. That's really sneaky and unfortunate that you've implement this feature into the game. Not only that but it just causes more problems. Players who DON'T have high command are at a significant disadvantage due to not being able to que 5 different units. And as mentioned above, the rushes are not good. Why change something that wasn't broke in the first place?

Maybe we can explore the negative speedrounds that EZ Dolittle suggested for players who don't like it.

@freezy

The middle part is about last time you think 1.5 game experience is OK. After the test, I think unit move speed is a bit slower than CoN. But it still similar. The main feature is, if you spread out your units. Then your enemy tend to crash you from a single direction. Even bad is - you didnt aware of this because you're sleeping. After a good dream then you can move your 1.5 game to Achieve Game

Since I like S1. Then why I dont like the speed......? Isnt that I already told you? S1 can produced any level units and you can produced any unit from any province. Is it hard to understand?

Which means I can use Lv5 factory to build a powerful lv1 troops with very short time and defend the attack.

That's another point why S1 successed.

Also public service announcement:

Up until now I have read every post and commented on most of them. This actually takes alot of time. I feel like we are reaching a state in the discussion where most feedback gets repeated and thus does not require answers from me anymore, as I have answered it already earlier in the thread. So instead of repeating myself all the time I would rather like to spend that time on improving the product

Therefore I will reduce my answers and probably only focus on new points that are brought up. Of course I will still read everything, so please keep the feedback coming!

I want to encourage everyone to point players who bring up certain points or questions that have been answered earlier in this thread to these answers.

Thanks everyone!

Tasmine wrote:

@freezy

The middle part is about last time you think 1.5 game experience is OK. After the test, I think unit move speed is a bit slower than CoN. But it still similar. The main feature is, if you spread out your units. Then your enemy tend to crash you from a single direction. Even bad is - you didnt aware of this because you're sleeping. After a good dream then you can move your 1.5 game to Achieve Game

Since I like S1. Then why I dont like the speed......? Isnt that I already told you? S1 can produced any level units and you can produced any unit from any province. Is it hard to understand?

Which means I can use Lv5 factory to build a powerful lv1 troops with very short time and defend the attack.

That's another point why S1 successed.

Also I don't see a major difference in how your enemy can crush you in S1 or in CoW1.0 or in CoW1.5. In all of those games/versions you have to spread your troops to protect certain points on the map, and in all of them the enemy can amass his forces and overrun your upgraded provinces while you sleep. Even in S1 or CoW1.0 you will probably lose when your enemy conquers your high level production facilities in your core territory, because you dont have the time/resources to build up all that again and throw him back before he sends more troops. The answer in all of those games is scouting and anticipating such moves.

As it's such a rare case that such a counter attack would succeed in all 3 games/versions I don't plan to change the whole balancing to account for this occasion.

S1 is also pretty new and just launched, we don't know yet if it will succeed, but I hope for the best

Let me clearify it more simply. In CoW 1.5 or 1.0. When you see a troop marched to your province with 1 hour time. And…you dont have too much units to protect it. Most possible way is to spend gold, fortify province. In S1, you can produced around 5 lv1 armored cars to protect it(with low level factory, morale also affect the time). And they will be very helpful when defending the province.

Ok so you advocate for much faster production times like in S1? That was not clear to me from your posts previously.

Regarding that we heard vastly different opinions in this thread, with some people saying times are too fast, some saying they are too slow. I would guess we are at a good middle ground right now.

As stated some posts earlier I will stop commenting every post now in this thread to make up some needed time

...S1 is like playing the manage art of morale. It's not a easy thing. It's not easy to produced anything fast. Only when you manage it well.

In S1, if you occuiped too much provinces. All provinces will tend to falling morale.

And in S1, we can own free militias on every provinces. It's not a new feature. It's the tradition of S1914, well...even I just played one game of it.

Dont ask me what is free militia, it's conscript.

Back to topic, if you cant control your morale. 0% morale will cost you double time to produce a unit. 50% is the standard. If you keep crazy occupying other nations without build something to control morale. Your average morale will be 20-30%. Do you know what it means?

And I dont think S1 is a newest game, for Bytro, of course it is(for a Bytro game age). But most important is, it absorbed many elements players want.

And it cost less memory than CoW, even compared to the previous version.