Call of War 1.5 round 2!

Also when everyone is saying well you only have 5 cities in Cow1.0 because it's so expensive, that's not true, I always build 2-3 industrial factories right away, even if it cuts into my research time, just because it's so important and beneficial. Costs a lot of money and trading, but the long run resource benefits are 100% worth it.

I really enjoy the direct response to our feedback! Its the best thing I've ever seen on a game, bravo! I apologize that I didn't have time to read the whole thread- so if my comment is redundant, just take it as reiteration.

I made a comment of the slow response time of aircraft due to refueling and faster initiation and resolution of ground battles making them arrive at the show too late. There are a couple refinements needed for aircraft:

1. Direct strike has less value vs patrolling due to patrols doing stated damage and refueling times in most cases unless you are trying to avoid patrolling a nearby strong anti-air capable stack, or just want a hit and run to get your aircraft back to safety or another target before you go offline. Can we somehow equalize the damage done/received per 30 mins for direct strike vs patrol at an average distance from airport? Patrol is super effective in this test run and I will only do a direct strike if I need to make the hit before 15 minutes of arrival. In the old version, patrol already had significant advantages and uses so I would have hoped you would have gone the other way and make direct strike more useful for specifically taking out known units in COW 1.5.2.

2.I think you should nerf Tac Bombers building damage. There is no need for strategic bombers when I recently patrolled and level to the ground 5 separate level one buildings, killing 2 artillery at the same time, with only 5 lev 2 Tac Bombers in just two hours. With the resource shortages, that would be costly to recover from for something that could be carried out and done while you watched a movie or any other fairly short activity.

Less troubling because it can be mitigated by caution and protecting air with ground units or building lev 2 airport: I have also grounded the enemies entire aircraft stack in just 15 minutes with a just two lev 1 Tac Bombers on patrol. I just mention this part in case it was an unintended consequence.

EZ Dolittle wrote:

Makes more emphasis on having High Command to Queue up troop production.

I have won a few games here and there. I have had High Command since a month or so after starting back in 2015. I find it affordable to pay by the year. I have also gotten a free extension a few times giving me an extra 6 months for free due to gifts by the company or as a reward in events.

As it stands right now even in 1.0, those that have HC have a significant advantage over those that don't. You get the following and I list them in order of what I find the most important advantages against your opponent.

1. Build Que for Units & Buildings
   • Load up what you want and as long as you have the resources, it will start building even when you are not on the game.
   • Other players that do not have this have to wait until they are back online. It means you could be significantly ahead of them in building your military.

I hope this helps you understand HC and it's value. First advice I always give to people in a map that ask me for advice is always, get HC and if you get it by the year, it is very affordable to anyone.

General cdub

Greetings freezy,

I want to thank you first hand for reading my post about 1.5 as well as everyone else’s post that sent in their feedback. It shows me and I am sure others how much you care about getting us a great game for all to enjoy. I know this must have taken a good part of your day if not longer to go through everything and attempt to sort out and reply to so many.

I hope you did not take my very long assessment as a complete negative as I was not trying to do that. I like so many others that love Call of War only want what’s best for a long into the future great game. I also appreciate your explanation of some of the things you as a company are trying to achieve. It gives me and I am sure many others a better understanding and a way to give you better feedback. While I agree now with some of the things I listed in my assessment post, there are still things that I may not agree with. I do have a better understanding though. Just the same, I understand that you and your design team have to do what you think is best not only for the majority, but the company as well. I am also very grateful that as you said, this is not the final product.

"Nedless to say we will try to improve 1.5 further and incorporate more feedback again in the next Event, plus adding more exciting features down the road. This is still not the end product and there is room for improvement."

As my game is pretty much over at this point, (just getting the final points now), I will list in bullet points the 5 best things that I believe will achieve this and list the 5 things that need improvement.

5 Things that are great in 1.5

• Damage being dealt out every 30 minutes compared to the current 60
• Less time & Cost to construct buildings at level 1
• The different buildings to build your units
• The build times of units decrease with higher level buildings
• You are able to upgrade your existing units after research

5 Things that need improvement

• Refueling times for Aircraft
• Starting out, there is not enough Cash and resources starting out. It’s about 1/3^rd of what we get in the current version.
• Point Provinces only in cities and you can only build units in cities
• Not being able to build any units in non-urban cities provinces
• No increase in range for Artillery Units even at the Elite Level

You have already responded about these items so I am in hopes, the next test of 1.5 will show improvement from not only what I said but the many others that took the time to give their feedback.

Again thank you for the responses,

General cdub

Now at day 11, a couple of new findings.

1- With the research really slowing down and the big power increase for higher tech levels (and units not being worth upgrading compared to building a new unit), I find myself in a bit of a trap where I don't want to build a L1 Mech Inf because I'm upgrading to L2, but by the time I get L2 researched it will nearly be time to upgrade to L3, and so on. Of course this isn't absolute, and I could always just suck it up and build L1s while I wait, but I am perpetually short on iron so this is where I am. It feels unnatural, so far. (i.e. USSR certainly never halted T-34 production for a year to wait for the next better thing to be ready for production.)

2- Rockets have an attack value vs air armour. Doesn't that suggest they can attack a flying plane, like a SAM? Can they?

Follow-up to my previous discussion: I eventually tried upgrading a crippled DD and was disappointed to find that the upgrade doesn't heal it. Paying the full new-unit price to get a 15% crippled unit upgraded is cuckoo.

CityOfAngels wrote:

2- Rockets have an attack value vs air armour. Doesn't that suggest they can attack a flying plane, like a SAM? Can they?

General cdub wrote:

Starting out, there is not enough Cash and resources starting out. It’s about 1/3rd of what we get in the current version.

General cdub wrote:

Not being able to build any units in non-urban cities provinces

General cdub wrote:

No increase in range for Artillery Units even at the Elite Level

VorlonFCW wrote:

General cdub wrote:

No increase in range for Artillery Units even at the Elite Level

I also miss this, but given that units don't automatically upgrade any longer this makes sense. I was always annoyed when I mixed a stack of Artillery and SP artillery and their ranges were different, as only the longest range units would engage the enemy and the others would sit there doing nothing. With the probability of having multiple levels of artillery mixed in one stack the multiple ranges would be very annoying in my opinion.

I can understand what you are saying. For a player that never wanted to use my resources to go to SP Artillery, (and it uses oil), I do not research or build SP Artillery. While I see your point, one could counter by saying you move them in. Such as I have always done when attacking an enemy unit during the cooling off period, (the 60 minutes it takes to deal out damage). I would also share with you though, is that not what we get from our Air Craft Distance when we have different levels of Air Craft?

I would ask that you reconsider this option. I believe it is a very big aspect in strategy to the game. If nothing else, at least a longer range for Artillery when they reach Elite Unit status. After all, if I am correct, at the beginning stages of World War 2, most artillery had a range of around 4 to 5 miles. With in three years though, artillery had reached 7 miles.

In the current version, we have three ranges, 60 at level 1 & 2, 70 at levels 3 through 5 and 80 at Elite. So maybe as a compromise, you set the range for 60 to start and at Elite you set it to 70. Just two settings and you have to upgrade all the way to Elite to get that range. I will say that at 50 it puts it too close to the front lines and can easily be caught if it has not ground support to protect it. I know, the next thing you will say is that any good player would never do that but I will say there is always an exception to the rule.

I ask again to please reconsider this. At least for the Elite Level. Otherwise, at the cost and time to build, why would anyone want to upgrade all the way to that level. In fact, I am not even sure I would want to upgrade my Artillery at all.

General cdub

First off with your comments regarding High Command, 1.5 further expands the need for High Command, giving non high command players an even higher dis-advantage without being able to queue units that are mass produced, requiring non high command players to constantly check their game, compared to once or twice a day. These games should be long, not short, which is why you have normal COW rounds and the sped up version for those who have time. While queues are in 1.0, they're no where near as effective as in 1.5.

Everything takes longer in 1.0, allowing players to build one unit and coming back on later in the day with the unit almost done, or not even close, which is how it should be, which is why we're allowed to build units in any providence we choose. It gives players a high degree of freedom, and provides good incentive to defend those providences and boost production. They're not even that expensive with all the money you're given at the start. Sell some resources, buy some and build them, that's what I do.

I think one of the new maps: call of war 1.5 map is a little unfair.

1.u spawn less cash

U spawn with no industrial complex

Day 12 of my 1.5 game. Overall, I think the game plays well. Lots of good stuff that improves play. And a few issues that I think decrease enjoyment,

1. Air Craft carriers are still completly useless. First, they holds 2 -6 "carrier" aircraft. That alone reduces this to a useless piece of floating metal. Or at best a jumping point for skipping planes accorss open sea. Even at max capacity, you need about a half dozen carriers to impact a battle. Very bad.

2. Bombers can no longer go on carriers. TBH, I wont research or fool with carrieres for this reason alone. What does go on them, I don't know. I suppose all thats left is fighters and Naval bombers.

3. Aircraft in general have reduced effectiveness because of the incresed ridiculous wait times.

4. Improvement to commando's is awesome. In fact, I probabvly will never build any other infrantry. Perhaps its a little out of balance when it eliminates the need for Infantry.

5. Finally, the jury is still out on the Unit leveling system. It is so vastly different that it will take some time to really get a handle on. However, the added complexity of multiple identical units at different levels, doesn't add anything enjoyable to the game. In fact, it's most a pain in the ass.

So don't get discouraged because I didn't highlight the good stuff. Its there. The areas noted above, should be improved for the next release.

Balhog wrote:

Bombers can no longer go on carriers

Seems to me 4-6 SQUADRONS of tac bombers is quite a powerful force.

However with the high cost of manpower to do research and manning,

unlikely we will see many high level carriers and tac bombers in

trials limited to 30 days.

Since the beginning of COW, level 4 tactical bombers wan be placed on air craft carriers

Tasmine wrote:

Back to topic, if you cant control your morale. 0% morale will cost you double time to produce a unit. 50% is the standard. If you keep crazy occupying other nations without build something to control morale. Your average morale will be 20-30%. Do you know what it means?

FinnDaddy wrote:

1. Direct strike has less value vs patrolling due to patrols doing stated damage and refueling times in most cases unless you are trying to avoid patrolling a nearby strong anti-air capable stack, or just want a hit and run to get your aircraft back to safety or another target before you go offline. Can we somehow equalize the damage done/received per 30 mins for direct strike vs patrol at an average distance from airport? Patrol is super effective in this test run and I will only do a direct strike if I need to make the hit before 15 minutes of arrival. In the old version, patrol already had significant advantages and uses so I would have hoped you would have gone the other way and make direct strike more useful for specifically taking out known units in COW 1.5.2.

2.I think you should nerf Tac Bombers building damage. There is no need for strategic bombers when I recently patrolled and level to the ground 5 separate level one buildings, killing 2 artillery at the same time, with only 5 lev 2 Tac Bombers in just two hours. With the resource shortages, that would be costly to recover from for something that could be carried out and done while you watched a movie or any other fairly short activity.

Less troubling because it can be mitigated by caution and protecting air with ground units or building lev 2 airport: I have also grounded the enemies entire aircraft stack in just 15 minutes with a just two lev 1 Tac Bombers on patrol. I just mention this part in case it was an unintended consequence.

So there are situations were a direct strike is more benefitial, for example if the target is close to the airport and the airport is on a higher level, with lower refuel times.

Building damage of Tactical Bomber is already 5 times lower than that of the Strategic Bomber. We can of course review the damage values again in the next event.

CityOfAngels wrote:

Now at day 11, a couple of new findings.

1- With the research really slowing down and the big power increase for higher tech levels (and units not being worth upgrading compared to building a new unit), I find myself in a bit of a trap where I don't want to build a L1 Mech Inf because I'm upgrading to L2, but by the time I get L2 researched it will nearly be time to upgrade to L3, and so on. Of course this isn't absolute, and I could always just suck it up and build L1s while I wait, but I am perpetually short on iron so this is where I am. It feels unnatural, so far. (i.e. USSR certainly never halted T-34 production for a year to wait for the next better thing to be ready for production.)

2- Rockets have an attack value vs air armour. Doesn't that suggest they can attack a flying plane, like a SAM? Can they?

Follow-up to my previous discussion: I eventually tried upgrading a crippled DD and was disappointed to find that the upgrade doesn't heal it. Paying the full new-unit price to get a 15% crippled unit upgraded is cuckoo.

Rockets also had an attack value vs. aircraft in CoW1.0. The reason for that Vorlon explained already above.

General cdub wrote:

I will say that at 50 it puts it too close to the front lines and can easily be caught if it has not ground support to protect it. I know, the next thing you will say is that any good player would never do that but I will say there is always an exception to the rule.

I ask again to please reconsider this. At least for the Elite Level. Otherwise, at the cost and time to build, why would anyone want to upgrade all the way to that level. In fact, I am not even sure I would want to upgrade my Artillery at all.

General cdub

Vorlon has a point here though and we will likely not change this.

Combat is now happening every 30min, so even though the arti range is a bit short than in 1.0, it now can get in more ranged hits before being caught by any troops.

The reason for upgrading the artillery will be the same as for every other ground unit as well: More damage, more HP. The cost-efficiency of leveling up is not different than from other ground units, and that's the way we want it to be.

In the right hands artillery is already a very powerful unit, as it allows you to decimate your enemy without taking any losses. That does not change in 1.5

cycle9 wrote:

The research tree in CoW 1.5 says that level 4 tac bombers ARE carrier capable.Seems to me 4-6 SQUADRONS of tac bombers is quite a powerful force.

However with the high cost of manpower to do research and manning,

unlikely we will see many high level carriers and tac bombers in

trials limited to 30 days.

Regarding the airplanes on carriers nothing changed from 1.0 to 1.5, the same planes and plane levels can go on carriers in 1.5.

Maybe we can make carriers more worthwhile in the next event

____________

Also just in general to everyone: We of course try to incorporate as much feedback in the next 1.5 version as possible and I already noted down many things mentioned here, just like we did from Event 1 to Event 2. But we cannot fulfill every wish, because sometimes opinions in this thread on a particular issue vary greatly and sometimes the wish also goes against our own conviction. So when I read in this thread something like "all these things need to be improved" I just hope that you will still be satisfied next time even when we won't do all of them

freezy wrote:

I have to say though that in my 1.5 game round I am not limited anymore in manpower in the slightest on day 12. I have too much manpower and cannot spend it because other resources run out earlier. That's probably because I have alot of high level Industries right now, so it seems that the manpower bonus given by them is too high. On the other hand manpower in the early days was too low, so thinking about increasing that but decreasing it for mid-late game.

Also dont tough manpower rates next test please. It is ok how it is.

Only tax encome should be higher (cash is another big chockpoint, we dont have enogh for spies now) and some costs should be lowered.

freezy wrote:

That's probably because I have alot of high level Industries right now, so it seems that the manpower bonus given by them is too high. On the other hand manpower in the early days was too low, so thinking about increasing that but decreasing it for mid-late game.

there are enough sim-city++ games out there already.

Khabarovsk krai wrote:

U spawn with no industrial complex

Industrial complexes only deal with resources, and have nothing to do with units at all.

cycle9 wrote:

please do not base any conclusions on turtle-down, build-but-do-not-attack strategy.

there are enough sim-city++ games out there already.

cycle9 wrote:

unlikely we will see many high level carriers and tac bombers in

trials limited to 30 days.

COMANDOS!

Comandos are a stealth unit now, which is awesome.

But i have an issue.

When moving on a country with Treat of Peace, Comandos as a stealth unit, shouldnt attack and capture a province ,which has no army, unless they are commanded to do so.

In that way the player will have the element of surprise to unprotected cities and also players have to build units with stealth detection or have some army on the borders of their country.

Quick update.

I like unit upgrade but is very expensive.

I looked at it and the cost to upgrade a lvl 2 artillery is the same as building a brand new one, this doesn't make any sense that amount would be double of a brand new unit.

Cost of Level 2 artillery to upgrade to Level 3.

Food-780

Goods-1,570

Manpower-1,290

Metal-390

Money-1,570

Cost of building a brand new Level 3 artillery.

Food-780

Goods-1,570

Manpower-1,290

Metal-390

Money-1,570

If anything, upgrading the units should be the difference between level 2 and level 3, if you have issues with balance perhaps add an hour for every level the unit is upgraded to. Or allow people to disband old units to get them off the payrole.

Thanks good luck.

Akulla3D

@Akulla3D

No need to upgrade from lvl1 to lvl2, or from lvl2 to lvl3. skip at least one level.

cycle9 wrote:

Balhog wrote:

Bombers can no longer go on carriers

The research tree in CoW 1.5 says that level 4 tac bombers ARE carrier capable.Seems to me 4-6 SQUADRONS of tac bombers is quite a powerful force.

However with the high cost of manpower to do research and manning,

unlikely we will see many high level carriers and tac bombers in

trials limited to 30 days.