ANZAC Day!

Happy ANZAC day! Remember the fallen, lest we forget.

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,

Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,

Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs

And towards our distant rest began to trudge.

Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots

But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;

Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots

Of tired, outstripped Five-Nines that dropped behind.

Gas! Gas! Quick, boys! – An ecstasy of fumbling,

Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;

But someone still was yelling out and stumbling,

And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . .

Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,

As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,

He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace

Behind the wagon that we flung him in,

And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,

His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;

If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood

Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,

Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud

Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,

My friend, you would not tell with such high zest

To children ardent for some desperate glory,

The old Lie; Dulce et Decorum est

Pro patria mori.

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Quasi-duck wrote:

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,

Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,

Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs

And towards our distant rest began to trudge.

Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots

But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;

Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots

Of tired, outstripped Five-Nines that dropped behind.

Gas! Gas! Quick, boys! – An ecstasy of fumbling,

Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;

But someone still was yelling out and stumbling,

And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . .

Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,

As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,

He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace

Behind the wagon that we flung him in,

And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,

His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;

If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood

Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,

Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud

Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,

My friend, you would not tell with such high zest

To children ardent for some desperate glory,

The old Lie; Dulce et Decorum est

Pro patria mori.

Wilfred Owen. Don't like him. Not patriotic. I prefer Rupert Brooke's 'The Soldier'.
The past is a foreign country.

Pablo22510 wrote:

Wilfred Owen. Don't like him. Not patriotic. I prefer Rupert Brooke's 'The Soldier'.
Post it, I love poetry. I've got two poetry books next to me 100+ years old :D

Anyway, would really expect Mr. Owen to be patriotic? He fought through some of the worst of WWI only to be shot dead crossing a canal on 4th November 1918. He served from 1915 onwards and died 7 days before the end of the war.

Damn, I getting teary.

If I should die, think only this of me:

That there’s some corner of a foreign field

That is for ever England.

There shall be

In that rich earth a richer dust concealed;

A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware, Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam,

A body of England’s, breathing English air,

Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home.

And think, this heart, all evil shed away,

A pulse in the eternal mind, no less

Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given;

Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day;

And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness, In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.

Died during WW1.

The past is a foreign country.

Pablo22510 wrote:

If I should die, think only this of me:

That there’s some corner of a foreign field

That is for ever England.

There shall be

In that rich earth a richer dust concealed;

A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware, Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam,

A body of England’s, breathing English air,

Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home.

And think, this heart, all evil shed away,

A pulse in the eternal mind, no less

Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given;

Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day;

And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness, In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.

Died during WW1.

Good poem. A pity that WWI broke out.

Quasi-duck wrote:

Pablo22510 wrote:

If I should die, think only this of me:

That there’s some corner of a foreign field

That is for ever England.

There shall be

In that rich earth a richer dust concealed;

A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware, Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam,

A body of England’s, breathing English air,

Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home.

And think, this heart, all evil shed away,

A pulse in the eternal mind, no less

Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given;

Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day;

And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness, In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.

Died during WW1.

Good poem. A pity that WWI broke out.
True. WW2 was necessary, but could've been solved with a lot less casualties if Germany had been stopped in '36, but WW1 was just senseless.
The past is a foreign country.

Pablo22510 wrote:

WW1 was just senseless
Truly so. In 24 hours at Gallipoli, I believe, around 5500 Australian warriors died for what? A pathway to the troubles in the Middle East we have now?

@Quasi-duck

JC Bants :00008172:


If Socialists understood Economics, they wouldn't be socialists
-Friedrich von Haye

How do you determine which war is necessary and which not? If they didn't need it, nobody would ever start any war.

oceanhawk wrote:

@Quasi-duck

JC Bants

What the hell is wrong with you? Remember the dead, discuss their sacrifices, hope they are in a better place, even if you believe there is not. Don't act like an ass.

Paramunac wrote:

How do you determine which war is necessary and which not?
I truly do not know. Was the Second Gulf War needed? I don't know. I can name many wars, both civil and international, that spring to mind.

Paramunac wrote:

If they didn't need it, nobody would ever start any war.
Ah, but what about ideologies? People may believe at the time it was right but tell me, do you think we should have a return of the Christian Crusades to save the Holy Land from those "Devil worshipers" (note, I care not for any religion)?

Whoever starts a war thinks that he (they) will gain something from it. From their view, that war is necessary, needed, desirable or whatever. And at that point, it is not relevant if someone else think it is senseless or not.

Paramunac wrote:

it is not relevant if someone else think it is senseless or not.
Well, I'll argue here. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, y'know?

Quasi-duck wrote:

Paramunac wrote:

it is not relevant if someone else think it is senseless or not.
Well, I'll argue here. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, y'know?
I am not sure how is that idea connected to anything discussed in this thread.

Paramunac wrote:

I am not sure how is that idea connected to anything discussed in this thread.
Oh, well, majority vote. Look at Vietnam. The US leadership thought it was necessary, but they were the few. The majority of the population did not want it so it was senseless because the many thought that it was senseless while the few thought it was necessary.

This can go down to a very personal level though, even to a war within ourselves. Hitler exemplifies this, he thought the world was always trying to pop one on him.

Quasi-duck wrote:

The US leadership thought it was necessary, but they were the few. The majority of the population did not want it so it was senseless because the many thought that it was senseless while the few thought it was necessary.
Well, it is not the population who decides, but those who rule (governments, leaders). If common people was that who made decisions, there would probably be much less wars. Honestly, I don't know what we are arguing. If your point is that WW1 was senseless from the view of people, I agree. I don't believe the it was the will of common Austrians and Hungarians to expand the empire. Like in almost every war, those who ruled wanted more power.

Paramunac wrote:

Honestly, I don't know what we are arguing.

Paramunac wrote:

Well, it is not the population who decides, but those who rule (governments, leaders).
This is it, I know you cannot have a vote but it should not take ten years or more for a govt. to pull out from an unfavorable war.

The best quote on war:

"I have never advocated war except as a means of peace." -Ulysses S. Grant

Sometimes a little bit of war is needed to prevent a bigger war and keep the peace.

The past is a foreign country.

Quasi-duck wrote:

oceanhawk wrote:

@Quasi-duck

JC Bants

What the hell is wrong with you? Remember the dead, discuss their sacrifices, hope they are in a better place, even if you believe there is not. Don't act like an ass.
seriously explain how I am?...

Maybe put your money where you mouth is.. tell me..

you have never before said anything sensible..... love to hear this


If Socialists understood Economics, they wouldn't be socialists
-Friedrich von Haye

oceanhawk wrote:

seriously explain how I am?...

Maybe put your money where you mouth is.. tell me..

you have never before said anything sensible..... love to hear this

You're not wanted here.

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