What would have happened if Hitler had died in 1944 and the German army had surrendered.
What is your opinion?
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Well, this has been an interesting read so far.
the German army was better organised, equipped with the best tactics on the eastern front, they got to moscow, and they forgot their coats, thats the story to the eastern front, the soviets had a failing regime, and Id say if hitler, didnt have such a disgusting hatred of slavks, Id say many would flock to join them. To be honest, I would much rather be living in nazi germany, than soviet USSR
plus the soviet poor equipment , tactics, moral( starving under a failing communist regime)
1 gun for 2 men at one stage, thats a fact dont argue with it
There were people who DID flock to them. There was a small Ukrainian army that cooperated and later joined the German army in 1941.
You are entire? Lol.Soldjer325 wrote:
You're entire
Generals do not matter if they have no ammo, or guns, or well trained men. Russians couldn't be stopped at Seelow heights by Germany's best best either.Soldjer325 wrote:
I could reference dozens more who could hold a firm line with Russia, despite superior numbers and any leadership they could offer
That is '41 and those tanks were terrible BT-7's and T-26's etc. The T-34/85 and IS-2 were top of the class.Soldjer325 wrote:
By the end of 1941, according to research by a team of Soviet historians, the Soviet Union lost a staggering 20,500 tanks from June 22 to December 31, 1941. At the end of November 1941, only 670 Soviet tanks were available to defend Moscow—that is, in the recently formed Kalinin, Western, and Southwestern Fronts. Only 205 of these tanks were heavy or medium types, and most of their strength was concentrated in the Western Front, with the Kalinin Front having only two tank battalions (67 tanks) and the Southwestern Front two tank brigades (30 tanks).
The Russians needed nothing post-'43. Let me remind you, this is '44.Soldjer325 wrote:
No outside intervention, like the 11 billion dollars worth of resources sent to Russia from the US, or the United Kingdom's crucial aid to Russia which included multiple tanks, aircraft, the training of Soviet pilots, and even parts for Soviet factorie
"Best tactics" is a lie. Look at Stalingrad. Or Leningrad. You're right, the 6th Army did get to Moscow, there is even photos.oceanhawk wrote:
the German army was better organised, equipped with the best tactics on the eastern front, they got to moscow, and they forgot their coats, thats the story to the eastern front, the soviets had a failing regim
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We are arguing in a 1v1 situation, and UK aid was crucial even in '44, because they needed the tools to rebuild their factories destroyed, by the Russians, during Germany's push east in '41. Without the aid of the west, Russia would've been much slower in their push west, and the forces used in the battle of the bulge could be used against the Russian's to reopen the east as a stationary fight for Germany.
Most of your evidence is Soviet Cold War era propaganda. Research more modern WW2 posts to gain a better understanding of the East front. The real information is still slowly coming out today.
You know the Russians just packed up their factories and left, right? The one factory I know of that was captured was the KV-2 factory, which was recaptured intact.Soldjer325 wrote:
We are arguing in a 1v1 situation, and UK aid was crucial even in '44, because they needed the tools to rebuild their factories destroyed, by the Russians, during Germany's push east in '41.
Both of those things is a load of bull. I get my info from American internet pages, British documentaries and British books. Oh, looky here, my favorite WWII book is written by a German! Lol, more baseless facts from Soldjer325.Soldjer325 wrote:
Most of your evidence is Soviet Cold War era propaganda. Research more modern WW2 posts to gain a better understanding of the East front. The real information is still slowly coming out today.
We both believe the other is using baseless facts
Haha wrong again, I know you are. For years I did little else other than play computer games, ride my bike and learn about WWII. I'm right. *raspberrys*Soldjer325 wrote:
We both believe the other is using baseless facts
And the debate continues on.... 
Ugh, I'm done dealing with you. Some others approached me believing in my theories over yours, I'm satisfied, and do not wish to continue this useless never ending debate. So, I'll end with this...
AMERICA!!!!!!!!
Yay, I win by default!
You jinxed itSir McSquiggles wrote:
And the debate continues on....
Awww, I was very interested by the topic.
I'm not gonna go on and on debating with this guy, I'm sorry, but I must concede knowing that I am the people's champion. 
No one ever said that. Another baseless fact.Soldjer325 wrote:
but I must concede knowing that I am the people's champion
duck never wins
he knows he lost, he just keeps going
like who is really gonna argue that the germans had inferior generals
he just keeps going, hmmm remiend me of somebody...
Remember to be polite folks.
Never said that, just that Germany didn't have enough of their good generals.oceanhawk wrote:
like who is really gonna argue that the germans had inferior generals
Interesting thread...
@Quasi-duck What do you think about Rommel?
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