Convoy HP inadequevat

There's a pretty simple answer for this: armor.

Transports are made of metal.

Soldiers are made of flesh and cloth.

Metal > cloth

Even a thin sheet of metal can stop a bullet or two. Cloth can't.

Besides, in 1.5 you can't stack more than 10 units without suffering severe consequences in speed and attack power.

what steal and flesh? i have a sub and a ship without any weapons carry some tanks.... if a launch a torpila from the sub, the trransport will sunk... w t ... this is the reality... also when i fight planes on the ground... how can damage my tank a plane that is on the ground like it happens last night? what changes are this that are from Star Trek?

Konvoys at Ww2 had escorts at least 1 korvette with antisubmarine weapons.

They fricked up the balancing in 1.5 just stick to 1.0. Thats what im doing now

A few weeks ago in a 1.5 game i had to deal with one unescorted convoy of more than 40 units

I threw everything i had at him, destroyers, naval bombers, bombers, but still no good, the convoy reached it´s location with minimum casualties while i lost a few units, that doesn´t make much sense to me

Good players know that they have to escort troops ships, but i guess if we stack a lot of units we can also have the job done

If you attack with 20 single units a stack of 40 it was 40 battles 40vs1. What are you waiting for? 40er stack of transportships lvl 3 has 800 HP`s but still only 20 damage vs ships and 13 vs submarines and airforces.

Also 10er stack of of lvl 2 navalbombers would kill it easy, 10er stack of lvl3 submarines would kill itt easy.

Transports should have attack/defense values of 0 across the board.

A submarine squadron should be able to sink transports without suffering damage.

The only way a transport survives is if a destroyer or other warship comes to its rescue.

Players who don't build a navy should have *no* protection.

except that transport vessels have a machine gun.

This is a hateful feature that rewards bad play.

There is nothing good about this.

z00mz00m wrote:

This is a hateful feature that rewards bad play.

There is nothing good about this.

Take this out of gameplay for a second: a submarine can maybe carry 20 torpedoes.

meaning in a 40 stack, at most, that submarine can sink 20 transports.

That's not even mentioning the fact that transports, especially later into the war, started arming up with machine guns and anti-sub depth charges.

So, if a sub surfaces to find a new target, who's to say those same guns wont harrass the subs a little?

Now, in a 1v1 between a submarine and a convoy, the sub will pretty much always win. Only exemption I can think of is if the sub is already crippled to start with.

But if you put 1 sub against 40 TRANSPORTS, you have an issue. Firstly, what the hell are you doing with 1 submarine against 40 units??? When has that ever worked? And secondly, there's no way in *hell* that submarine can take on all of those ships at once.

So here's the solution. Use a friggin battleship. Maybe even a cruiser. Use something with RANGE. Then it doesnt matter how much damage you do to it: they cant fight back.

The transports are actually just fine as they are. They're even a bit historically accurate. Your issue isnt the transports, it's your own strategy.

is clear you have no clue on how a subs fight and is operating... never a ship, or 40 ships with a machine gun, can damage to destruction a subs... cause the subs is under water... you never know from where that torpila launched is coming from... let;s be realistic... where in the war you have see transport by them self, they allwyas have a strong escort exactly becuase withour they are sitting ducks! Lets be realistic. The same problem with the planes on the ground... they can never damage a tankk when thery are in a prickup truck on the road!!!

You have no idea what war mean...

Zimbrisor wrote:

is clear you have no clue on how a subs fight and is operating... never a ship, or 40 ships with a machine gun, can damage to destruction a subs... cause the subs is under water... you never know from where that torpila launched is coming from... let;s be realistic... where in the war you have see transport by them self, they allwyas have a strong escort exactly becuase withour they are sitting ducks! Lets be realistic. The same problem with the planes on the ground... they can never damage a tankk when thery are in a prickup truck on the road!!!

A periscope can only do so much for you. Submarines would regularly surface to get their bearings... and look for new targets.

Not to mention moving through the water creates a faint trail: a Submarine rests about... let's say 5 meters below the surface (before firing a torpedo)? Because that's how Torpedoes work. They can only travel in a straight line in 1942. A submarine has to come dangerously close to the surface to fire a torpedo. The "underwater" part is for reconnaissance almost exclusively.

And it's during this window that a transport can shoot at a submarine, and damage the hull.

Furthermore, a plane on the ground can still fire its guns, albeit not very well. Convoy members carry small arms, like a pistol or revolver, and while those aren't very effective against tanks, they can kill infantry members no problem.

So, once again, the attack values make sense.

Please, do your research before you make claims like this.

EDIT: Merchant Marines had no escorts, yet they managed to get to Britain because they had safety in numbers.

EDIT 2: clarification on how early torpedos work.

Convoy protection does make sense. The issue I'm having with the way transports work in 1.5 is that the protection is free. To get a proper convoy, the user should start in a port. The port should have warships. Those warships should be part of the convoy as it leaves port. That's a proper convoy.

Right now, I can send the entire German army to some random stretch of sand, have them board transports that appear out of nowhere, those transports get free warships to protect them out of nowhere, and then the army can go wherever it wants. It's ludicrous. Without sensible restrictions on what/how/when convoys can start, discussions of A/D values won't make a lot of sense.

z00mz00m wrote:

The issue I'm having with the way transports work in 1.5 is that the protection is free

z00mz00m wrote:

To get a proper convoy, the user should start in a port.

z00mz00m wrote:

those transports get free warships to protect them out of nowhere,

z00mz00m wrote:

Without sensible restrictions on what/how/when convoys can start, discussions of A/D values won't make a lot of sense.

When the British evacuated Dunkirk, it was a national tragedy.

All of the heavy weaponry and ammunition was left behind.

They spared the men from becoming POW's but those units were no longer operational.

Translating to CoW, boarding a transport from a rural tile should only work for infantry.

Artillery and mechanized units should be disbanded and maybe return some "manpower" to the pool.

But there is no way a tank division should be able to cross continents with impunity.

Implementing a more nuanced "embarcation" story adds relevance both to navy units and port infrastructure.

Given enough time a transport ship can load heavy machinery using various cranes and winches that can be clearly seen in this diagram.

[/img]

Habo778 wrote:

Given enough time a transport ship can load heavy machinery using various cranes and winches that can be clearly seen in this diagram.

[/img]

This is all fine, in a railroad-and-major-road-accessible-deep-water-port.

But there is a reason why different units have different amphibious capabilities.

A typical heavy tank division has no amphibious capabilities. The tanks must be loaded like any other heavy cargo, in ports that can handle heavy cargo. And they cannot disembark on a beach

A marine battalion may be different. They have different equipment, different training. Their tanks are not nearly as heavy. Their A/D values are not as good. But they "might" be able to land on a beach.

Consider the logic for paratroopers. Do you expect *every* unit type to have those capabilities? Of course not! They require specialized training and specialized equipment, and paratroopers do *not* have heavy weapons, thus they cannot fight tanks as well as motorized infantry.

Yet when it comes to amphibious capabilities, we allow the equivalent of heavy tanks dropping from the sky.

This could be a big opportunity to improve the game, especially when it comes to cross-continental warfare. We should not be able to land a heavy tank division in Nome, Alaska, just because it's close to Siberia. It would be a lot more interesting if the amphibious and airborne stages of an invasion had to build up to a full mechanized landing, after the light-weight airborne and amphibious troops manage to capture a port. Now that would be interesting!

A way heavy machinery was unloaded on a beach was to build a temporary floating dock right on the beach. I believe this was called something like J railing but I can’t seem to find any pictures. Another way heavy machinery was unloaded used a special landing ship that would open up in the bow and have the cargo just drive out tho these craft where highly specialized and were not with regular convoys. [/img]