Unrealistic city destruction

When towns around the world eventually grew into cities, their importance did as well. As their populations swelled Major metropolis's were now becoming significant sources for food, fuel, and water. They contained manufacturing centers ,industrial quarters, rich commercial zones with some also having ports, air fields and rail lines. In any army during WW2 that advanced on one of these, the hope of every common soldier was that the enemy had fled and left it open so there would be no fierce house to house fighting, no difficult scavenging for supplies and no uncomfortable sleeping amongst the rubble of ruined buildings. The generals also hoped for capturing the city in tact, but for different reasons. Seizing undamaged buildings and factories that produced supplies or products for war was a big bonus. Depending on who occupied the city, it was also a source of civilians that could be forced into labor battalions, or simply allowed to carry on with their day to day routines, keeping resentment to the occupiers at a minimum. So no commander would ever order his troops to automatically destroy such a valuable prize when one of his units enters an unoccupied enemy population center. Now if say the enemy has units approaching to retake the city, that is when the commander should have the option to destroy or at least cripple anything that could be of use to the enemy before evacuating. THE WAY IT WAS ALWAYS DONE. The present rules are absolutely ridiculous, forcing destruction on entering a city and not being able to even break a window when leaving. This completely unrealistic situation has been shamefully ignored or overlooked and is just another example why you should hire me as your chief war game designer before it's too late. I like you guys a lot and respect the good work you originally did on the historic games, but your company has lately discouraged a lot of people from playing the so called Historic WW2 game. Mostly it's people who have played from the beginning, claiming the badly bungled balancing policy of equalizing all cities to 10 points, and severely limiting where unit producing buildings can be started and the ultra ridiculous fees and construction times for buildings and units, were only some of the communities common core complaints. Casually confident cooperating companies, continuously connected, can clearly capture confused Callofwar cadets, causing catastrophic corporate capitulation . Could cold calculated calmly conveyed conversation comfortably convince cornered cute cuddly candy cane carrying Colonels, capable contestant's cars consistently crash, cruising countless carelessly created courses, contributing considerable costly consequences, counting casualties, clearing corpses, collecting cash. Clandestinely controlling crooked content, completely covering conspicuous crimes, constantly camouflaging criminal constructions colorfully concealed ?

10 Replies

Well, I support the idea but note that β€œrealistic” is not bytro’s main priority on a game.

Also, these factories don’t immediately change the production to your armies tank . On day it produces a panzer , the other day it cannot produce sherman . It takes some time for them to learn how to build it.

and don’t tell me you were drunk writing the second part where u wrote every word that u know start with the letter β€œc” .

Yes Tgufyru I agree. Most of the Bytro staff I've conversed with seem to almost detest history. I wonder if they will soon start toppling statues? And as for their inability to assign accurate combat strength, movement, hit points and capabilities to the 1939 Historical WW2 armies, I was appalled. The original historic world war two game being way too slow was my only real beef, so I was happy with 1.5 and its faster pace. But a pattern has quickly come to my attention, brought on by all the new changes. By having to spend longer periods of time dealing with all the different new buildings in 1.5 you take valuable time away from warplay which a few seconds lost or longer, can and has meant the difference between final victory and defeat because of the critical timing involved. The changes by dividing the industry and other buildings does nothing to improve the game except to lengthen it, with what most players I know in most games on line, or on board games, do not like for mixed reasons. "I'm here to go to war damn it! Not to play bloody Monopoly!" said the old general. Another observation was the unnecessary unliked changes to raising your units tech. Because players constantly need armies and don't often have the luxury if at war to upgrade as many units as desired, or even any at all. The cost of raising most tech levels is much too high and made even worse with low morale affecting the province If you want people to like the economic side to this game, you have to give them something good, not make it more difficult or less exciting as well as obviously not caring much about historical accuracy, which if the researchers had done their job correctly and maybe read a little more about the past, they would I hope realize many other mistakes they made assigning incorrect combat strengths, hit points, movement points, abilities, handicaps, tech levels, and number and types of starting units. I warned the Bytro staff that the Hasbro company might sue them for copyright infringement, mistaking WW2 1.5 for a rip off of their "RISK game"

simon wrote:

cadets, causing catastrophic corporate capitulation . Could cold calculated calmly conveyed conversation comfortably convince cornered cute cuddly candy cane carrying Colonels, capable contestant's cars consistently crash, cruising countless carelessly created courses, contributing considerable costly consequences, counting casualties, clearing corpses, collecting cash. Clandestinely controlling crooked content, completely covering conspicuous crimes, constantly camouflaging criminal constructions colorfully concealed ?
Did you just study the dictionary :thumbsup:

simon wrote:

Most of the Bytro staff I've conversed with seem to almost detest history. I wonder if they will soon start toppling statues? And as for their inability to assign accurate combat strength, movement, hit points and capabilities to the 1939 Historical WW2 armies, I was appalled. The original historic world war two game being way too slow was my only real beef, so I was happy with 1.5 and its faster pace. But a pattern has quickly come to my attention, brought on by all the new changes. By having to spend longer periods of time dealing with all the different new buildings in 1.5 you take valuable time away from warplay which a few seconds lost or longer, can and has meant the difference between final victory and defeat because of the critical timing involved.
Cities have been heavily damaged when captured since the start of COW, so why complain about it now. At least in 1.5 it doesn't take ages to build something like it was the case in 1.0.

simon wrote:

If you want people to like the economic side to this game, you have to give them something good, not make it more difficult or less exciting as well as obviously not caring much about historical accuracy, which if the researchers had done their job correctly and maybe read a little more about the past, they would I hope realize many other mistakes they made assigning incorrect combat strengths, hit points, movement points, abilities, handicaps, tech levels, and number and types of starting units. I warned the Bytro staff that the Hasbro company might sue them for copyright infringement, mistaking WW2 1.5 for a rip off of their "RISK game"
I remember your previous posts about the Historcal map. First of all your reactions are rash at best and very subjective. As Freezy has already replied to you is that Bytro tries to find the balance between Historical accuracy and gaming experience. Frankly it isn't cost effective to try to accomodate hardcore historical fans whom will never be 100% satisfied, knowingly that 99% of the playerbase is happy with the game.
BMfox
Moderator
EN Community Support | Bytro Gmbh
Check out my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/BMfoxCallofWar
Found a bug or need help? Send a ticket here!

Well I would think that 'describing my statements as "Rash" would need a more detailed explanation to clarify the difference between that word and constructive criticism. Don't get me wrong. Out of all the companies that I have come across trying out their electronic computer games, Bytro was the best. If I am berating, bugging or blasting someone, it is usually because in some capacity either great or small, I care about them and would not waste my breath on them if I didn't. Just because I strongly disagree with your reasons for wanting to 'balance' a historical game, does not mean I do not respect your ability to create these games in the first place. We have much in common and I being an experienced team player having served in the Canadian armed forces as a communications electronic engineer, would cooperate, compromise, and complete projects with fellow designers to the benefit of Bytro. Shit, I have to go! I'm at work and will finish this later if I get a chance.

Those who never played 1.0 may be 'happy' with 1.5 but almost everyone I've talked to on facebook or other sites outside the game, who like me, did play the earlier version, did not like the "balanced" game, so I must respectively disbelieve and dispute your claim of 99% I just don't understand why you can't keep the old 1.0 that so many of us love as a choice to play? If it is too much for your computers to handle, then it is somewhat understandable, but if it is anything else like changing history because of the fear of being called a racist for letting weak countries getting too easily destroyed, then your company has been compromised and that is such a shame. Simon to the rescue though. Oh damn I gotta go again. Remember, all I want to do is make your company and myself a lot of money.

This is a game, you have to balance. Otherwise only 5-6 are predestined to win, the test would be cannonfodder. And 1.5 takes more brain to play, so it is better then 1.0

simon wrote:

Those who never played 1.0 may be 'happy' with 1.5 but almost everyone I've talked to on facebook or other sites outside the game, who like me, did play the earlier version, did not like the "balanced" game, so I must respectively disbelieve and dispute your claim of 99% I just don't understand why you can't keep the old 1.0 that so many of us love as a choice to play? If it is too much for your computers to handle, then it is somewhat understandable, but if it is anything else like changing history because of the fear of being called a racist for letting weak countries getting too easily destroyed, then your company has been compromised and that is such a shame. Simon to the rescue though. Oh damn I gotta go again. Remember, all I want to do is make your company and myself a lot of money.
From my experience most player were upset with 1.5 as most people don't do well with change. The human race is a creature of habit after all. However most of the players that gave 1.5 a chance have told me that the 1.5 version has grown on them. There's only a small minority who believes that 1.0 was better. Please note that malcontent people will scream the loudest while happy people stay silent. Personally, I believe that everything in 1.0 took ages. In 1.5 the game play is more fluent and even in the early game there's more access to different units. The added doctrines have really enhanced the game. 1.0 games were just copy/paste time after time and there were no surprises before day 8. 1.5 is much more various.
BMfox
Moderator
EN Community Support | Bytro Gmbh
Check out my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/BMfoxCallofWar
Found a bug or need help? Send a ticket here!

I disagree Ivan. The top five countries are not predestined to win. They have a better chance of winning if they know how, would be a more accurate assessment, because I have won many solo victories playing Sweden, Turkey, France, and even India. In one game not long ago, I played South Africa. I could not afford to buy gold and only had a few thousand saved from past victories. There were only seven players left and three of them, Britain, China, and Yugoslavia, were in a coalition. Australia was having trouble fighting the A.I. commanded Dutch and New Zealand forces, and the Americans were still fighting the A.I. of Mexico. For the first week of the game I laid low, then surprise attacked the Caribbean and South America. By the end of the second week I had conquered everything except Brazil and Argentina, and I let the Americans take Havana, so we would remain on friendly terms. Now the coalition noticed me as I moved into second place and they started making plans to take me out. I knew they would and had already made my own plans to lure them to the bottom of Africa, where I set up a deadly ambush. The only spy I could afford was in London and had intercepted enough of the coalition's messages to not only refine my trap, but learning the Yugoslavian and the Chinese wanted nothing to do with an African campaign, let me release a large part of my surface fleet and about seven or eight crack motorized regiments including commandos and paratroopers to sail to the Orient. The Brit and Yugo had taken horrendous losses in Europe, and against Japan the Chinese had suffered even worse. They were terrible generals who lost more men than they killed, built wrong or ridiculous units too far away from their front lines, rarely raised their tech levels, and when they did, again they usually picked the wrong units. Only the Brit seemed to have some rudimentary knowledge of economics. My spy subs confirmed that except for a couple of level three in British territory, none of their coastal cities had resource producing factories higher than level two. I on the other hand had a half dozen at level five, and many many more at level four. They put all of their resources into replacing the hundreds of thousands of troops they continually lost in disastrously planned battles, and were plagued by very low morale and constant revolts. Nearing the end of the third week I had the highest morale tech level, and the largest economy. My secret fleet of 20 subs guarding S.A. were the highest level in the game and were waiting for his main battle fleet that had finally left Britain. They were being shadowed by a couple of subs I had sent up a week ago. 5 battle ships 2 carriers with no planes, 5 cruisers and 3 destroyers that never once had their tech raised, were escorting 15 badly mismatched units being slightly to seriously damaged. So my air force, which was also at the highest tech level than any other player, kept track of all his reinforcements coming down from Egypt. About 35 to 40 fast moving regiments in stacks of 3 to 6 were dangerously spread out in a long sinuous line and foolishly placed with 1st level militia units. This gave me more time to prepare for his reinforcements arrival which were mostly motorized, self propelled, armored and high tech, but all that time and money was wasted on building a highly mobile force when he stacked them with the slowest moving militia regiments. Meanwhile back in the Dutch East Indies, my strike force of two 4th level carriers carrying a dozen 5th level naval and tactical bombers, a dozen 3rd level destroyers and six 5th level cruisers took the last of the Dutch cities and began regrouping to invade Japan, that the Chinese had left completely empty and defenseless while the bulk of their army moved to their western borders. This was not only going to be an unexpected and highly unusual upset, but a great slaughter as well. The next day I woke early and 5 minutes after I had started the game the internet was cut off from our entire apt. complex! I freaked! I phoned everyone I knew to see if I could use their internet connection, but they were out and about, at work, or just not answering. I had maybe ten or fifteen minutes before my attack was to begin and units that I had yet to move would be discovered and the element of a highly coordinated surprise attack would be lost. I had one more chance. It was my day off so I ran to my place of work that has the internet. I'm an overdose prevention unit supervisor for the 'Solid Outreach Society' here in Victoria British Columbia and I usually manage a safe injection site with other 'harm reduction' workers where some strict rules must be followed. One of these rules is you are not allowed to go to the site if you are not working. I thought well this is an emergency and my fellow employees won't mind or say anything since couples often break that rule to visit each other when working different shifts, and none of them minded at all. I got into our office and had my laptop up and running in record time when in walks our head boss in a foul mood. Long story short, I had to immediately leave. Because of the fake pandemic, coffee shops and libraries were shut so my only hope was to run back to my apt building and see if the internet had returned, It had! I turned on my computer just in time! Just in time to see the blue screen of death appear and my computer die in front of me. It would take two more days before I could acquire a new lap top and by then almost all of my land, sea and air forces had been destroyed, South Africa was completely over run, and three sleepless weeks of probably the hardest game I ever played and was about to win with one of, if not the worst country in the game. Too bad all those bizarre events happened because if I had won a solo with the worst country in the game, that would really take strength away from your claim that only the top 5 or 6 countries are destined to win. And it does not take as you so eloquently put it, 'more brain' to play 1.5 It just takes more time. More units, more buildings, MORE TIME. That does not make 1.5 better. It makes it longer. And you don't make any sense saying this is a game that MUST be balanced. You can't balance historical accuracy with 'what ever you mean by 'gaming experience' No wonder Bytro can't find the 'balance' BECAUSE THERE IS NONE. A game is either historical or not. Even though there were a few things in 1.0 that were not entirely accurate, I never complained or heard anyone else make a fuss because it was close enough, so your claim that people will never be 100% satisfied is also rubbish. I've been playing and designing all sorts of games as a hobby for almost 50 years and have a deep understanding on what people like and hate about them. All you had to do was speed up 1.0 to half hour attacks instead of the hour long wait. Instead your organisation not only gets rid of the original game, allowing your oldest loyal customers no choice in which one they would rather play, but the one that is left, has been simply ruined by the unnecessary and destructive balancing forced upon it. Maybe your group should go to the U.N. and claim no more real wars should happen unless countries are balanced first. If it works and your masters win a Nobel Peace prize, I'll consider apologizing if I've hurt anyone's feelings by unbalancing them with my constructive criticism. Bring back 1.0 and quit calling 1.5 historical. I'd hate to see some politically correct woke freak Karens get offended and sue Bytro for false advertising and go after the company's bank balance! ;)

Bro can you please break ur stuff up into paragraphs rather than typing walls of text?

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